WORLD EXCLUSIVE: The massive rift driving Prince Charles & Harry apart

Allie · December 06, 2009, 08:33:39 PM

Quote from: Mimi-chan on December 05, 2009, 11:52:07 PM
I personally find it rather sad that the boys seem to have had to seek fatherly affection from other men especially with their father still being alive. I've never delved deep into either of the boys' childhood therefore am not extremely knowledgeable about the many figures brought up here (such as Ken Wharfe) but I find it extremely disturbing that their father has been so absent and let other people "father" his children -- especially considering the fact that they lost their mother.

If this is the typical parenting philosophy within the royal family... then it's really no wonder so many of them have issues!

I totally agree with you. Personally, I don't think that they are all that close. What they do in front of a camera and what they do at home could be two completely different things. To me, Charles has always seemed too concerned about himself to worry about anyone else.

Ursula · December 06, 2009, 09:24:49 PM

Quote from: Stix Chix on December 06, 2009, 07:22:43 PM
Quote from: Ursula on December 05, 2009, 04:18:38 AMI've often wondered whether the story about Harry wasn't payback of some sort - maybe from a Camilla/Bolland connection.

ack! don't say that....i dislike her enough already. :laugh:

I know how you feel ;) but what better way to level the playing field when people find your own son unsuitable to keep company with two princes.

Quote from: Stix Chix on December 06, 2009, 07:22:43 PM
....the best thing a father can do for his children is to love their mother.

Amen!

drezzle · December 07, 2009, 08:05:23 PM

Quote from: Lucy on December 06, 2009, 05:46:29 PM

I don't believe this article and still believe that Charles and Harry are close.

It's curious how the Willyites deny that he is close to his father and Camilla, but Harry is instead. Then the Harryites deny that he is close to Charles and Camilla but that William loves his mommy Camilla so much.

The first and main time I noticed a problem between Harry and Charles was the day Harry returned from Afghanistan and William and Charles met him at the airport. I didn't keep a copy of the video but it's probably out there somewhere. That's not to say the problem is serious or ongoing. Overall, I still think that, while not spectacular, Charles was good enough as a parent. He certainly was a better parent to his sons than his own parents were to him.

Ursula · December 07, 2009, 11:57:53 PM

drezzle, I found this youtube video of his return from Afghanistan. I'm not sure what you meant....but I think Harry was just angry and disappointed about having to return early.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm6m4lfq7TQ

Lucy · December 08, 2009, 04:17:01 PM

Right, Ursula.
Plus Harry has gone to unprecedented lengths to declare his love for Camilla...testifying he loves her to bits....and above I posted a picture of Charles patting Harry on the back, not that long ago at polo. A very tactile picture for the POW.
Now if Charles is not pleased with Harry reuniting with Miss Davy, that's another story altogether. Maybe Harry wants to pack it in with the Army and go traveling with her.

drezzle · December 08, 2009, 09:44:35 PM

When asked, Harry said they love her to bits -- that includes William, and Wills did not contradict Harry. That could also be a generic statement from someone who has been taught good manners. Furthermore Camilla has been to many more official fxns for William than she has for Harry. In fact can anyone name one official ceremony for Harry attended by Camilla?

Ursula · December 08, 2009, 11:28:05 PM

Yes, I think the "love her to bits" comment was pure diplomacy. What else could he say considering the position their dear father put them in?

Hale · December 08, 2009, 11:37:15 PM

Quote from: drezzle on December 08, 2009, 09:44:35 PM
When asked, Harry said they love her to bits -- that includes William, and Wills did not contradict Harry. That could also be a generic statement from someone who has been taught good manners. Furthermore Camilla has been to many more official fxns for William than she has for Harry. In fact can anyone name one official ceremony for Harry attended by Camilla?

I also recall William going out to a restaurant in the evening with Camilla and members of her family. I do believe I saw those pics here on the forum, but cannot remember when this event took place.

Quote from: Mimi-chan on December 05, 2009, 11:52:07 PM
If this is the typical parenting philosophy within the royal family... then it's really no wonder so many of them have issues!

Yes Mimi-chan its typical royal parenting. Following the Queens return on a Commonwealth tour, the Queen was greeted at the train station by the late Queen Mother and a very young Prince Charles. PC was totally confused by the woman standing before him. He wasn't sure how to react and he wasn't sure who she was.

I think PC does what he thinks best, but he doesn't know any better. I also agree that PC was and is preoccupied by Operation Camilla.

Mimi-chan · December 09, 2009, 01:12:00 AM

Hale -- that is really sad to me. Because (ironically) proper parenting could've helped the Royal Family's reputation so much. If the RF wants responsible hard-workers who are going to strengthen the Firm then the RF must start raising their kids that way.

mousie_kins · December 09, 2009, 03:35:04 AM

What is William and Harry supposed to say when asked how they think of Camilla " I hate her she is a $%&* " :haha:
They probably have a cordial relationship when they spend time together which is probably rare as they don't really live at home anymore. As has been mentioned by them before, they like how Camilla makes their dad happy. They love their dad and just want him to be happy.

Stix Chix · December 10, 2009, 12:16:11 AM

^exactly. they lost their mother....i doubt if they want to lose their father by letting Camilla come between them. if its true that Harry and William "love her to bits" then good. i admire their manners and forgiveness....because i would be the stepdaughter from hell. :devil:

Ursula · December 10, 2009, 01:45:13 AM

Quote from: Stix Chix on December 10, 2009, 12:16:11 AM
i admire their manners and forgiveness....because i would be the stepdaughter from hell. :devil:

She deserves one. ;)

whisperofsound · December 10, 2009, 06:15:55 AM

chuckles . . she still as a option if one or both have a girl someday.

Wickedly Good · December 10, 2009, 11:13:06 PM

I think it is difficult to judge what anyone's relationship is with their parents given that very few people in our lives have an inside view into our true feelings and relatability. We can look at pictures, video and interactions but what we see and hear in public is probably not even a 1/10th of an insight into how these two interact.

I have to agree that it is sad from an outside perspective the formality and distance that a royal upbringing seems to have but I do hope that PC was not as distant as his own parents have been portrayed to be. I think that for some time he was consumed with what someone else called "Operation Camilla", but I hold out hope that all of that is behind him to some degree and he is able to have a more balanced view on his family and especially his sons given the resonsibilities and duties that will have to undertake in their lives. Maybe it is just hopeful on my part to think that way, but it would be a shame to suffer through these same types of things in your own life and not do anything about changing that for your own sons.

Lucy · December 10, 2009, 11:29:04 PM

Harry cannot speak for William about thinking Camilla is wonderful and loving her to bits...if he was too scared to say it for himself alone, so be it...but he is the only one he can speak for.

We will soon see if Haz goes back to Africa or announces his engagement.

Ursula · December 10, 2009, 11:58:58 PM

Wickedly Good, Operation Camilla is in full swing and Charles won't rest until she's crowned Queen. Until that time, I'm afraid his sons won't be his priority. I'm not saying he's the worst father around, but he hasn't done as much as he could, especially considering the boys' ages when they lost their mother.

Wickedly Good · December 11, 2009, 12:23:59 AM

You are probably right Ursula and I agree that he hasn't done as much as he could. I am not a huge PC fan but I would like to give him the benefit of the doubt when it comes to his sons. I hate the thought of them having missed out on a mother as well as dealing with their father's pre-occupation with paving the way for Camilla to be Queen. I am not all that certain Camilla really wants that...but then again, I cannot fathom her life choices and how she reconciles her actions and what they did to her family and Charles' for that matter.

Mimi-chan · December 11, 2009, 12:42:01 AM

Queen Camilla... :puke:

Hale · December 14, 2009, 10:12:58 PM

Quote from: Mimi-chan on December 09, 2009, 01:12:00 AM
Hale -- that is really sad to me. Because (ironically) proper parenting could've helped the Royal Family's reputation so much. If the RF wants responsible hard-workers who are going to strengthen the Firm then the RF must start raising their kids that way.

Mimi-chan, I don't disagree with you, but I don't see how the RF can do otherwise. They have duties to perform, places and overseas visits to make. As well as private meetings and entertaining in order to nature possible charitable donations. I just think their jobs and lifestyles get in the way.

As for Charles, it is sad. Some kids are just naturally resilient. I happen to think Andrew and Edward are two and as for Anne, well......she's a tour de force. I wonder if he has been able to learn from his own childhood and at least found a better way of communicating with his own children or has he inherited his own parents difficulties in this?

It's an interesting topic which Drezzle has posted. I didn't give much thought to this question before although I should have when one considers there has been a continued ongoing battle between sons and fathers. The historian, David Starkey, said in one of his many excellent documentaries that when Edwards VII died George V broke down and sobbed. It was the first time in over a hundred years that a son had cried for his father. How sad is that?

scooter · December 29, 2009, 04:31:10 PM

Quote from: Ursula on December 07, 2009, 11:57:53 PM
drezzle, I found this youtube video of his return from Afghanistan. I'm not sure what you meant....but I think Harry was just angry and disappointed about having to return early.
uti
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm6m4lfq7TQ

Charles certainly doesn't display any happiness to see Harry when they are getting in the car. BTW...can someone tell me why Charles is wearing a SCALLION as a boutenniere?

someonewholovesharry · December 29, 2009, 06:36:46 PM

Quote from: Stix Chix on December 10, 2009, 12:16:11 AM
if its true that Harry and William "love her to bits" then good.

I think that Harry was not sincere telling in his interview about his and his brother's attitude to the Duchess as "love her to bits". The time when Harry gave that interview was very hard and the situation around the prince Charles's 2 wedding was acute, and if Harry told something like "we don't like her"(what I think is truth in deed, because she is the woman which hurt their's mum a lot) it would make the things going even worse and give more reasons to hate Camilla.
He behaved like he was trying to maintain a good image of the RF and to make us sure that "inside" everything is fine.
It was quite wise on his part, I think.
But for me it is absolutely clear that he was pretending saying like that.

Satrine · December 29, 2009, 07:28:39 PM

Stix, very good points. Even if they divorce they father/mother should still show respect for each other at least for the children. Based on the article above seems like nothing has changed much in the RF, it's all about power/PR & if their own children need to be "sacrificial lamb", to better their image than so be it. It just like a chess game but w/real people. Is their anyone in the RF who actually loves their children w/o any motives behind it?

someonewholovesharry · December 29, 2009, 09:11:03 PM

I think that probably the only one member of the RF who actually loved her children w/o any motives was Diana. It's a pity, but now she's not a member - so then no one does.

Ursula · December 29, 2009, 11:36:01 PM

Quote from: someonewholovesharry on December 29, 2009, 06:36:46 PM
I think that Harry was not sincere telling in his interview about his and his brother's attitude to the Duchess as "love her to bits". The time when Harry gave that interview was very hard and the situation around the prince Charles's 2 wedding was acute, and if Harry told something like "we don't like her"(what I think is truth in deed, because she is the woman which hurt their's mum a lot) it would make the things going even worse and give more reasons to hate Camilla.
He behaved like he was trying to maintain a good image of the RF and to make us sure that "inside" everything is fine.
It was quite wise on his part, I think.
But for me it is absolutely clear that he was pretending saying like that.

I agree with you - I think Harry felt obligated to say that. The response was too automatic - he knew the question was coming and he was prepared for it. He was mature enough to understand that nothing would bring his mother back and there was no point in hurting his father or giving the press a mole to turn into a mountain.

daibando · December 30, 2009, 10:33:27 AM

Quote from: scooter on December 29, 2009, 04:31:10 PM
Charles certainly doesn't display any happiness to see Harry when they are getting in the car. BTW...can someone tell me why Charles is wearing a SCALLION as a boutenniere?

It was answered at the time, but it's a leek, one of the national emblems of Wales (the others are the daffodil and the red dragon).