Late Diana,Princess of Wales admitted that Prince Charles wishes Harry was girl

[amabel]

Their photo schedule is their business.  I pointed out Charles twirling around Camilla's granddaughter was when she was smaller. ANd it was used. SO what would be the big deal if the photographs included some of the children at younger ages. I am not getting why you single out Charlotte for "bad behavior." George was pictured having a tantrum and Kate correcting him.

Probaby they used a pic of Camilla's grand daughter from I think Will's wedding because its the only 1 of him and the kid (can't remember her name).
I am not saying Charlotte was behaving badly, I said she was acting normally for a child of her age.. and that may include not wanting to pose with Grandad on that day.. or running around and having to be held...
as For George, was he having a tantrum during the Charles birthday photos or was this on some other occasiona

[sandy]

I don't recall if it was the one who was bridesmaid or Tom's daughter. In any case the child was still small so it was from a few days ago.

It was during Pippa's wedding so George is not above having tantrums.

[amabel]

I don't recall if it was the one who was bridesmaid or Tom's daughter. In any case the child was still small so it was from a few days ago.

It was during Pippa's wedding so George is not above having tantrums.

no wonder Poor child. He should not have had to go to the wedding at his age....

[sandy]

His AUnt Pippa wanted him to be there. ANd Kate and Will agreed.

[amabel]

yes but they should not have.  I think its very unfair on small kids to be dressed up idioticaly for a wedding.. and when they are royal they're going to be photographed...and if they do get upset or act up, its all over the papers/net.

[sandy]

It was Kate's and Pippa's choice.

[amabel]

It was Kate's and Pippa's choice.

obviously.  I think it is awful. And I've seen brides who have  had to bow to family pressure to have little relatives as attendants, ending in tired cross children who spoil a lot of the day.....

[wannable]

I'm worried about the 1% who's little one did a 1 hour max duty at a wedding, later where with nanny Maria (other children and nannies) with a special children's buffet of goodies, lightbulb moment of Carole and Pippa the Party Planner.

sarcasm, they are Easter egg hunting as we speak.

[TLLK]

One thing that I noticed about the Cambridge, Sussex and Princess Eugenie/Jack Brookshank weddings is that  the very youngest attendants appear to have been quietly taken away as soon as the bride made her way up the aisle to sit out the actual service. (Nanny Maria was photographed holding the youngest bridesmaid at the Sussex wedding the within moments of the bridal party entering SGC.) So I believe that is an improvement over the tradition of having the little ones sit through an hour long service. Also at the Sussex wedding the youngest members of the party arrived with their mothers who helped arrange everyone in order. Catherine did the same for Pippa at her wedding.

[wannable]

Quite, and ex BP chefs have said the children always (the 1%) have their special kiddies meal accompanied by their nannies....

[TLLK]

I'm worried about the 1% who's little one did a 1 hour max duty at a wedding, later where with nanny Maria (other children and nannies) with a special children's buffet of goodies, lightbulb moment of Carole and Pippa the Party Planner.

sarcasm, they are Easter egg hunting as we speak.

Yes I expect that they watched that video of William at Andrew and Sarah's wedding and decided to come up with another plan for the service.
I noticed that even at the foreign royal weddings that the very youngest ones were taken away for the wedding service especially if there were two in one day-Civil and religious.

Anyhow back to the photos, kids under  6 can get restless when taking photos so if the this was the case, the photographers and family members would know when to call it quits.

[sandy]

It is a scenario that is projected. THere were no stories of Charlotte stopping additional photos from being taken. It is unfair to me to blame her for it.

Actually, William himself had little kids as attendants at his own wedding and Pippa had to round them up during the procession into the Cathedral. So apparently he thought it OK as did Kate.

[TLLK]

Perhaps it is time we returned to the actual topic-Charles wishes that Harry was a girl.

IMO whatever Charles did or did not say at Harry's birth is irrelevant now as the pair seem to have grown close over the years.

[sandy]

If Charles had wanted a daughter he could have tried again. He most likely knew he would not have more though Diana early on talked about wanting to have "a lot" of children.

[oak_and_cedar]

In earlier times the monarch or heir to the throne would try to have, well maybe it's wrong to say as many children as possible, but certainly more than two.

I find it fascinating that he did this for a woman that he presumably didn't even deem "worthy" to bear his children. Is there any explanation to this? I just don't understand it.

Only one reason comes to mind, perhaps he was fine being a bachelor and only married out of duty?

[royalanthropologist]

What exactly did Diana hope to achieve by revealing such information? I think she did not foresee the damage that it could potentially do to a child to let the world know that he was the wrong sex. She already knew about that, given another of her revelations that her own father wanted a boy.

I read somewhere that Charles wanted no more than two children. Since they had a son already, he had been hoping for a girl. I do not think it is out of the ordinary for parents to want a mixture of sexes among their children.

Diana knew Harry was a boy and never told Charles...very clear sign of the dysfunction and lack of communication setting in. When he allegedly thoughtlessly exclaimed at the birth that he was a ginger and a boy, she duly reported it to the press. Why? why? why?
Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 04:38:31 PM

In earlier times the monarch or heir to the throne would try to have, well maybe it's wrong to say as many children as possible, but certainly more than two.

The average family size in Europe is around 2 children. Actually the queen's father also had two. Queen Victoria more than made up for the lot. I dare say that the taxpayers may not want to have large royal families to support, so perhaps it is all for the best.

[oak_and_cedar]

Maybe she didnit want to disappoint PC? Especially after perhaps realizing that he only wanted 2 children.
I don't think PH was offended by it. In my opinion.


Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 04:41:32 PM

The average family size in Europe is around 2 children. Actually the queen's father also had two. Queen Victoria more than made up for the lot. I dare say that the taxpayers may not want to have large royal families to support, so perhaps it is all for the best.

Yes, but royalty is a different matter. They have to take other things into account. I don't Think that King George VI and QM could have more than two, if I remember correctly. Even king George's father had more than two.

[royalanthropologist]

I find it fascinating that he did this for a woman that he presumably didn't even deem "worthy" to bear his children. Is there any explanation to this? I just don't understand it.

Your statement is a bit ambiguous but I take it you mean Camilla being unsuitable?

If so, I do not think Charles has ever expressed to anyone that Camilla was not worthy to be his wife, consort or bear his children. It was always others ( Mountbatten, palace flunkies and later a hostile section of the public) that kept telling him she was unsuitable.

Diana ticked all the boxes...except in the one department...love. Charles married her because it was what everybody wanted and said was the right thing to do. Meanwhile his heart was really yearning for Camilla.

I believe that if Charles had been left alone to make his own choice in a marriage partner, a Camilla (if not already married to APB) would have pretty much topped the list. They were other mistresses but none has attracted the singular devotion of Charles to the extent that Camilla has.

If they had a do-over (impossible now), I think Charles would have married Camilla right from the beginning. However, there is a catch...some say that at the time he could have proposed, she was more interested in APB. It was all a bit of a mess.

[wannable]

What exactly did Diana hope to achieve by revealing such information? I think she did not foresee the damage that it could potentially do to a child to let the world know that he was the wrong sex. She already knew about that, given another of her revelations that her own father wanted a boy.

I did not know she said this out loud.  :cry: :no: :(

Parents should count their blessings with 'healthy' children.  Period.

[royalanthropologist]

Maybe she didnit want to disappoint PC? Especially after perhaps realizing that he only wanted 2 children.
I don't think PH was offended by it. In my opinion.

No of course not. In the early years, Diana was actually eager to please. It was just that Charles did not reciprocate (not altogether surprising when your husband is in love with someone else).

I think that the fact that they were allegedly very close towards the birth of Harry gave Diana hope that at the very least a child could bring them closer together. I think she was rather surprised and very hurt that he abruptly switched off after Harry was born.

Even if they had problems before, the closeness around Harry's birth gave her real hope...then it was suddenly and irrevocably dashed. I think that is why she later began to feel that she had been used, abused and discarded.

In her mind, there were too many coincidences... the fact that it was exactly the 5 years that DOE had allegedly advised Charles to give it ago, that now the family had their heir and spare, the fact that Charles went back to the woman he had sworn to love forever on the eve of his wedding...etc. all made her think that it was the plan all along.

To put it crudely, get her up the dough twice and be done with it. That is why she became so bitter about the whole thing. 
Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 05:01:40 PM

I did not know she said this out loud.  :cry: :no: :(

Parents should count their blessings with 'healthy' children.  Period.

I am sorry if I misled you. Diana never said it aloud and certainly she loved her children very much. She just reported to Morton and he wrote about Charles' exclamations. I think at the time she wanted to portray him as a bad father who did not appreciate his child (we now know that is a complete nonsense). The thing is that she did not realize that by revealing such information, she could end up allowing Harry to feel unwanted.

[amabel]

One thing that I noticed about the Cambridge, Sussex and Princess Eugenie/Jack Brookshank weddings is that  the very youngest attendants appear to have been quietly taken away as soon as the bride made her way up the aisle to sit out the actual service. (Nanny Maria was photographed holding the youngest bridesmaid at the Sussex wedding the within moments of the bridal party entering SGC.) So I believe that is an improvement over the tradition of having the little ones sit through an hour long service. A

I think it is quite ridiculous using such tiny children.. esp at Meghan's wedding one of htem was practically a baby In arms.  and if they are so small that they have to be taken out before the service starts I think its just using them to "look cute.."
Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 05:04:37 PM

Perhaps it is time we returned to the actual topic-Charles wishes that Harry was a girl.

IMO whatever Charles did or did not say at Harry's birth is irrelevant now as the pair seem to have grown close over the years.

I don't believe he was all that bothered. I think Diana hyped it up that Charles was so heartless as to complain that Harry was a boy when he had wanted   a girl.  If he was alos (as she put out the story) on the verge of leaving her for Camilla once H was born, why would he care  a damn what gender H was?
Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 05:07:57 PM

Maybe she didnit want to disappoint PC? Especially after perhaps realizing that he only wanted 2 children.
I don't think PH was offended by it. In my opinion.


Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 04:41:32 PM

Yes, but royalty is a different matter. They have to take other things into account. I don't Think that King George VI and QM could have more than two, if I remember correctly. Even king George's father had more than two.

I don't think so.  The queen mother had one caesarian and I think because of that, they didn't even try to have a male heir..  but stuck with their 2 girls.  Generally royals nowadays have only about 2 kids, like the average family size

[oak_and_cedar]

Your statement is a bit ambiguous but I take it you mean Camilla being unsuitable?

If so, I do not think Charles has ever expressed to anyone that Camilla was not worthy to be his wife, consort or bear his children. It was always others ( Mountbatten, palace flunkies and later a hostile section of the public) that kept telling him she was unsuitable.

Diana ticked all the boxes...except in the one department...love. Charles married her because it was what everybody wanted and said was the right thing to do. Meanwhile his heart was really yearning for Camilla.

I believe that if Charles had been left alone to make his own choice in a marriage partner, a Camilla (if not already married to APB) would have pretty much topped the list. They were other mistresses but none has attracted the singular devotion of Charles to the extent that Camilla has.

If they had a do-over (impossible now), I think Charles would have married Camilla right from the beginning. However, there is a catch...some say that at the time he could have proposed, she was more interested in APB. It was all a bit of a mess.

I think perhaps PC deemed her unsuitable. He did use the excuse that he was too young to marry or something similar.

Perhaps he was in agreement with Mountbatten and others? I've read that he's rather conservative in his outlook so perhaps in this area he is too.

I think he found Diana "suitable" which is why he pursued her and ultimately proposed to her. Diana was, in my opinion, a "catch" for men of her class, and this includes the prince of wales. Charles did make his own choice, and he chose Diana.

I believe if he had to make a choice over again, perhaps he might not have chosen Diana, but he would not have chosen Camilla. I think he was fine with her being his mistress.

Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 05:23:36 PM

No of course not. In the early years, Diana was actually eager to please. It was just that Charles did not reciprocate (not altogether surprising when your husband is in love with someone else).

I think that the fact that they were allegedly very close towards the birth of Harry gave Diana hope that at the very least a child could bring them closer together. I think she was rather surprised and very hurt that he abruptly switched off after Harry was born.

Even if they had problems before, the closeness around Harry's birth gave her real hope...then it was suddenly and irrevocably dashed. I think that is why she later began to feel that she had been used, abused and discarded.

In her mind, there were too many coincidences... the fact that it was exactly the 5 years that DOE had allegedly advised Charles to give it ago, that now the family had their heir and spare, the fact that Charles went back to the woman he had sworn to love forever on the eve of his wedding...etc. all made her think that it was the plan all along.

To put it crudely, get her up the dough twice and be done with it. That is why she became so bitter about the whole thing. 

Well, can one really blame her?
She had essentially been sold the image of a real, proper marriage.
And then it turned out to be something different, and she was stuck.
It was her great misfortune, in my opinion, to get married to the POW.

[amabel]

I think perhaps PC deemed her unsuitable. He did use the excuse that he was too young to marry or something similar.

Perhaps he was in agreement with Mountbatten and others? I've read that he's rather conservative in his outlook so perhaps in this area he is too.

I think he found Diana "suitable" which is why he pursued her and ultimately proposed to her. Diana was, in my opinion, a "catch" for men of her class, and this includes the prince of wales. Charles did make his own choice, and he chose Diana.

I believe if he had to make a choice over again, perhaps he might not have chosen Diana, but he would not have chosen Camilla. I think he was fine with her being his mistress.

Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 05:23:36 PM

W

Diana was not a "catch".... as such. She had youth, prettiness and wealth and came from "the right class", but at 19 or so, she was not a very developed mind.. and she did not have many boyfriends.. nor do I think that anyone other than Charles proposed to her.  For him, she was pretty, sweet and being young and having no past, that was his main requirement as the future King. ANd I think he was fond of her and believed that she was warm hearted and young enough to be adaptable and fit into the RF..
As for Camilla, I think if he could go back to being say 25, he would have asked Camilla.. but at that age, its possible that she would have preferred Andrew PB...(Plus I don't think she wanted that sort of public life...)

[royalanthropologist]

Well, can one really blame her?
She had essentially been sold the image of a real, proper marriage.
And then it turned out to be something different, and she was stuck.
It was her great misfortune, in my opinion, to get married to the POW.

I do not think anyone from within or without her family has ever sold Diana an "image of a real, proper marriage". Right from the outset, it was clear that there were issues and that is why she wanted to pull out. She also knew that essentially Charles was marring her because he was expected to marry her...not that he was a man deeply in love with her who could not bear to spend another moment without her being his wife. Charles was super, super unromantic with her from the beginning.

Marrying POW brought Diana many advantages...her children being the most important of them. I might not sure she would have given those up.  Besides, there is no guarantee that marrying someone else would have made her any happier. I mean all her later relationships were not exactly images of romantic bliss. I personally think she took a risk. The risk being that despite all she knew or suspected, she could somehow make the marriage meet her expectations...and then it didn't.

I feel that had she thought of it as a gamble that went the wrong way, the coping with and recovery from the breakdown would be much easier on her. Sadly, she spent a good deal of her adulthood reminiscing and complaining about a marriage that was destined never to work no matter what she did. It is very difficult to make someone fall in love with you when they are in love with another person...Trying to do so can drive you to extremes.

[oak_and_cedar]

Diana was not a "catch".... as such. She had youth, prettiness and wealth and came from "the right class", but at 19 or so, she was not a very developed mind.. and she did not have many boyfriends.. nor do I think that anyone other than Charles proposed to her.  For him, she was pretty, sweet and being young and having no past, that was his main requirement as the future King. ANd I think he was fond of her and believed that she was warm hearted and young enough to be adaptable and fit into the RF..
As for Camilla, I think if he could go back to being say 25, he would have asked Camilla.. but at that age, its possible that she would have preferred Andrew PB...(Plus I don't think she wanted that sort of public life...)

Diana WAS a catch. Especially at nineteen. What is a developed mind, in your opinion? Lack of sexual experience does not exclude someone from being a catch. It certainly didn?t prevent prince Charles from pursuing her.

Most biographies on Diana has several suitors saying that they would have liked to get to know Diana.

And she was only nineteen by the time she started dating Charles. She was still young.

I believe those were HIS personal requirements. I don?t believe he would have proposed to Camilla

Double post auto-merged: April 20, 2019, 06:31:35 PM

I do not think anyone from within or without her family has ever sold Diana an "image of a real, proper marriage". Right from the outset, it was clear that there were issues and that is why she wanted to pull out. She also knew that essentially Charles was marring her because he was expected to marry her...not that he was a man deeply in love with her who could not bear to spend another moment without her being his wife. Charles was super, super unromantic with her from the beginning.

Marrying POW brought Diana many advantages...her children being the most important of them. I might not sure she would have given those up.  Besides, there is no guarantee that marrying someone else would have made her any happier. I mean all her later relationships were not exactly images of romantic bliss. I personally think she took a risk. The risk being that despite all she knew or suspected, she could somehow make the marriage meet her expectations...and then it didn't.

I feel that had she thought of it as a gamble that went the wrong way, the coping with and recovery from the breakdown would be much easier on her. Sadly, she spent a good deal of her adulthood reminiscing and complaining about a marriage that was destined never to work no matter what she did. It is very difficult to make someone fall in love with you when they are in love with another person...Trying to do so can drive you to extremes.

I hardly think her parents would have wanted her to be married to someone who only wanted children from her and then to carry on with the mistress.

I don't think she knew that he was "supposed" to marry her. When someone pursues you, you assume that they are interested in you. To assume otherwise is illogical. If it was so obvious that he was supposed to, why didn't he tell her outright? Because in all likelyhood she would have said: no, thanks to his proposal. So, he had a vested interest in convincing her otherwise, in my opinion.

She had her doubts, but I believe he could be charming and persuasive. I don't believe he was super, super unromantic. He even wrote her notes etc.

I believe she was in love and accepted a proposal based on that. I think she came to regret it later on.

I don't think that any of her later partners could be deemed as "upstanding". She did the best she could with what she had. If she had a proper marriage with Prince Charles she would have never got involved with any of those "gentlemen".

I think she wanted a proper marriage, and this is why I believe that her biggest mistake was in marrying Prince Charles. If he didn't love her he should have left her alone. Perhaps then she could have found someone who loved her back and she would have had a real marriage as she always wanted.