QEII in her 90's how should her family be assisting her?

TLLK · July 23, 2019, 09:20:16 PM

I started this in the PoW forum but realized it was more relevant here in Elizabeth's. :D

My original question.

Out of curiosity, what suggestions do posters have regarding how QEII's children and grandchildren who work for the "Firm" could or should be helping her with her duties? I frequently read something along the lines of "_________ should be doing more to help QEII," without any suggestions of a specific duty.

So RIF posters could you please share specific examples of tasks that you believe QEII's children and grandchildren should taking on due to any age related issues Elizabeth might have? (I am of the opinion that they are currently supporting her with duties/obligations at this point in time in the manner that she has agreed to, but I sense that not everyone agrees with me.)

sandy · July 23, 2019, 11:13:52 PM

Charles is taking on duties in addition to his own. Therefore someone needs to take up the slack, this would be William and if William does his own and his father's then Harry takes some of them up. William as future King is two heartbeats away and should learn on the job. It is not known what the Queen agrees to or wants: William did step up after he gave up the ambulance work.. It's the natural order of things and William and Harry are in their thirties, their father is pushing 71 and his mother is 93. I don't see why it would be an issue if the others stepped up which I think is a reason that a line of succession is in place.

TLLK · July 24, 2019, 12:07:32 AM

@sandy-Thank you for your response. Yes I do agree and realize that Charles is taking on duties in addition to his own especially QEII's foreign travel. William like his father and aunt is also assisting QEII with the investitures throughout the year so I would consider that to be part of his "on the job training." Also all of QEII's children/spouses and her Wales grandchildren/spouses are undertaking more overseas travel to the Commonwealth nations and other countries. Again I find that this is excellent "on the job" training for her heir and the heir-to-the-heir. Also noted in the CC is that both Charles and William are stepping up to take a more hands on management with the Duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall.
QEII has chosen in recent years to relinquish the patronage of some of her hundreds of groups and her family have stepped up to take these on. This offers the younger members to become more actively involved and for the patronages to have a new representative for their work. :)

@sandy-Do you have any specific suggestions regarding QEII's current duties that you believe her children/their spouses and Wales' grandchildren/their spouses should take on to assist QEII? Should they take on some of her ceremonial military roles? Should they accompany her to various outings?

Curryong · July 24, 2019, 02:58:28 AM

I get the sense that, like Philip until his late 90s, Elizabeth is fiercely determined to do her duties for as long as she possibly can. Hence her remark recently when someone offered to help that she was 'perfectly capable of planting a tree!' And so her children and grandchildren do as much as they can to help without standing on her toes so to speak!

We don't see much specifically yet. It's all subtle. Because the Queen can no longer climb the winding stairs to sit in her top seat at the Order of the Garter ceremony Charles now does it. Her children have been seen individually accompanying her at many engagements, even extremely busy people like Anne. It's plain the Queen enjoys that. She misses PP by her side for sure.

The Queen has reputedly had trouble with her knees for several years but it's clear that some days are better than others with that. However there may well come a time when the steps at the Houses of Parliament are too much and Charles may be opening Parliament on the Queen's behalf, including the speech but without the Crown.

amabel · July 24, 2019, 07:01:34 AM

Quote from: TLLK on July 24, 2019, 12:07:32 AM
@sandy-Thank you for your response. Yes I do agree and realize that Charles is taking on duties in addition to his own especially QEII's foreign travel. William like his father and aunt is also assisting QEII with the investitures throughout the year so I would consider that to be part of his "on the job training." Also all of QEII's children/spouses and her Wales grandchildren/spouses are undertaking more overseas travel to the Commonwealth nations and other countries. Again I find that this is excellent "on the job" training for her heir and the heir-to-the-heir. Also noted in the CC is that both Charles and William are stepping up to take a more hands on management with the Duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall.
QEII has chosen in recent years to relinquish the patronage of some of her hundreds of groups and her family have stepped up to take these on. This offers the younger members to become more actively involved and for the patronages to have a new representative for their work. :)

@sandy-Do you have any specific suggestions regarding QEII's current duties that you believe her children/their spouses and Wales' grandchildren/their spouses should take on to assist QEII? Should they take on some of her ceremonial military roles? Should they accompany her to various outings?

I would imagine that the RF are capable of working out what the queen is up to doing these days, (She clearly is still determined to go on as much as she can and I don't think she will ever completely give up her work).. and to share out the duties that she is not up to. Will and Harry are doing full time royal work nowadays.. and Charles is taking on some more of the queen's more strenuous duties and she no longer does travelling jobs...

Princess Cassandra · July 24, 2019, 02:00:15 PM

Thank you for asking this question, TLLK. Here is my opinion: I think they (meaning the royals and staff) have already figured out how the responsibilities will be distributed and when. They have already begun, and in a very sensible and organized way. Every once in a while there may be big changes, such as when the Duke retired and several patronages were handed down from both the Queen and the Duke. If the Queen should get ill very suddenly, I think there is probably a plan in place for that, too. But I think the hope is that she will gradually do less and be comfortable with those engagements she can still take on. It's remarkable how much she smiles wherever she goes, which proves to me that she is happy with how the plan is going so far. But perhaps one of the concerns of many is that Charles seems to be taking on more and more, and his sons should be taking some of the pressure off of him. I have an opinion about that, too: He wants to do it ....he loves what he does and is finally seeing results...he wants to do more while he still can as POW, because when he is the Sovereign that will all change. He will be unable to take on the projects he does now to support his passions and causes. You can't do those things if you are the Sovereign. He was recently filmed exclaiming, "...but there is so much more I want to do!"

TLLK · July 24, 2019, 02:19:01 PM

Thank you everyone for your responses!

@PrincessCassandra and @sandy-You've both pointed out that with the PoW taking on duties for his mother that his sons should be stepping up to help him with some of his duties. Again like @Princess Cassandra I agree that Charles is passionate about his causes and duties and wants to be very involved with them so IMHO he might be reluctant to hand them off. Beyond William starting to be the representative at the Duchy of Cornwall meetings, do either of you have any suggestions as to what William and Harry could do to assist him? :)

amabel · July 24, 2019, 03:06:55 PM

Quote from: TLLK on July 24, 2019, 02:19:01 PM
Thank you everyone for your responses!

@PrincessCassandra and @sandy-You've both pointed out that with the PoW taking on duties for his mother that his sons should be stepping up to help him with some of his duties. Again like @Princess Cassandra I agree that Charles is passionate about his causes and duties and wants to be very involved with them so IMHO he might be reluctant to hand them off. Beyond William starting to be the representative at the Duchy of Cornwall meetings, do either of you have any suggestions as to what William and Harry could do to assist him? :)

but they are doing more. Both of them were part time royals..now both are full time. They are doing foreign tours, taking on patronages thtat the queen or Phil used to have.

TLLK · July 24, 2019, 03:22:56 PM

Yes I agree @amabel but I was wondering if anyone had some other specific suggestions on how they could assist QEII and the PoW as often times there are calls for the brothers to "do more" without any examples of how they're to do just that.

amabel · July 24, 2019, 03:36:59 PM

Quote from: TLLK on July 24, 2019, 03:22:56 PM
Yes I agree @amabel but I was wondering if anyone had some other specific suggestions on how they could assist QEII and the PoW as often times there are calls for the brothers to "do more" without any examples of how they're to do just that.

I agree... But I think they are doing what the RF as a whole and particularly the queen want. She IS doing a bit less, each year but she is still active. Will and H are now taking on things, leaving her free to concentrate on what she CAN still do OK -. I believe that Anne and the other kids sometimes accompany her to engagements so she has company and support esp now that Phil is not with her.

Curryong · July 24, 2019, 03:53:07 PM

My feeling is that the Queen's children and grandchildren are doing as much as they possibly can do to assist Grannie without irritating her. I remember when Will joined the Air Ambulance there were calls from the media for him to go fulltime on Royal duties as his grandparents were in their 90s.

In a brief interview he inferred that it was difficult to do more as he (and presumably his wife, brothers and York cousins) had offered several times but that his grandparents were prepared to work to the end. (Of course things have changed since Philip's retirement but I can imagine the Queen saying to her grandsons 'I, and your father, aunt and uncles, can manage very well at the moment, thanks'.) In other words 'The new reign will come soon enough. Until then I'm in charge and I soldier on.'

TLLK · July 24, 2019, 04:09:26 PM

:goodpost: @Curryong and :goodpost:@amabel

Curryong · July 24, 2019, 04:14:15 PM

I do wonder sometimes whether the Queen dreads the new reign. Not for herself naturally as she won't be around to see it, but for the future of the British monarchy. Charles is unpopular. It's no good saying he isn't. In the chapter Pernicious Lies in the new bio Jobson discusses the British public's reaction to Charles and what the POW feels are the myths implanted by Diana and the media that are continuing to harm him. Of course there are other things, Camilla is not really accepted either, and Charles is still regarded as a bit of an eccentric and meddler.

The trouble is that although the media at the moment are largely ignoring the coming reign republicanism may well get an upsurge and it will be discussed. I don't believe it will be enough to unseat the BRF but this long long reign and the huge respect the Queen is held in by many people doesn't bode well for her successor. It would still be an huge jolt even if Charles was enormously popular. But he isn't and Charles knows it and IMO the Queen does too.

amabel · July 24, 2019, 06:08:41 PM

I'd like Charles to have his turn. but Im not very bothered about William

sandy · July 24, 2019, 11:04:44 PM

Quote from: Princess Cassandra on July 24, 2019, 02:00:15 PM
Thank you for asking this question, TLLK. Here is my opinion: I think they (meaning the royals and staff) have already figured out how the responsibilities will be distributed and when. They have already begun, and in a very sensible and organized way. Every once in a while there may be big changes, such as when the Duke retired and several patronages were handed down from both the Queen and the Duke. If the Queen should get ill very suddenly, I think there is probably a plan in place for that, too. But I think the hope is that she will gradually do less and be comfortable with those engagements she can still take on. It's remarkable how much she smiles wherever she goes, which proves to me that she is happy with how the plan is going so far. But perhaps one of the concerns of many is that Charles seems to be taking on more and more, and his sons should be taking some of the pressure off of him. I have an opinion about that, too: He wants to do it ....he loves what he does and is finally seeing results...he wants to do more while he still can as POW, because when he is the Sovereign that will all change. He will be unable to take on the projects he does now to support his passions and causes. You can't do those things if you are the Sovereign. He was recently filmed exclaiming, "...but there is so much more I want to do!"

William is the heir to the heir. He also has to be on call for both his grandmother and his father. In the event that one or both are ill he would for that interim need to step up and do more. Especially since his grandfather retired.

amabel · July 25, 2019, 08:36:16 AM

but he is doing that. He is now doing investitures, foreign tours, full time engagements.. and Charles is doing some of the things that the queen used to do but now isn't quite fit enough to do.. which involve a lot of standing or walking. I think that they've planned things quite well.. Charles and the queen bot have very good health and are rarely ill but Im sure that William could take on things if it idd become necessary...

TLLK · July 25, 2019, 02:22:31 PM

@amabel-IMO what you stated is true and I agree that the BRF seem to have planned things quite well. I believe they've tried to take every scenario into consideration and prepare for it. Should QEII and the PoW's health or deaths require William to step in as the regent or become the monarch or to shoulder more responsibilities he'd be able to do so.

QuoteMy feeling is that the Queen's children and grandchildren are doing as much as they possibly can do to assist Grannie without irritating her.

:D IMO @Curryong has stated what I believe to be true.

amabel · July 25, 2019, 02:23:53 PM

Of course he will. He has staff to support him and other family members..

TLLK · July 25, 2019, 02:55:25 PM

Yes. This is a well run machine and they've prepared as best they can IMO for when QEII's reign ends and other possibilities.

amabel · July 25, 2019, 03:08:53 PM

Quote from: TLLK on July 25, 2019, 02:55:25 PM
Yes. This is a well run machine and they've prepared as best they can IMO for when QEII's reign ends and other possibilities.

I think it helps hat the queen has such excellent healtlh. She is harldly ever ill and has only been in hospital maybe twice In her life. SO while the children and grandchildren are helping, she is not giving up her work

Princess Cassandra · July 25, 2019, 03:49:30 PM

Quote from: Curryong on July 24, 2019, 04:14:15 PM
I do wonder sometimes whether the Queen dreads the new reign. Not for herself naturally as she won't be around to see it, but for the future of the British monarchy. Charles is unpopular. It's no good saying he isn't. In the chapter Pernicious Lies in the new bio Jobson discusses the British public's reaction to Charles and what the POW feels are the myths implanted by Diana and the media that are continuing to harm him. Of course there are other things, Camilla is not really accepted either, and Charles is still regarded as a bit of an eccentric and meddler.

The trouble is that although the media at the moment are largely ignoring the coming reign republicanism may well get an upsurge and it will be discussed. I don't believe it will be enough to unseat the BRF but this long long reign and the huge respect the Queen is held in by many people doesn't bode well for her successor. It would still be an huge jolt even if Charles was enormously popular. But he isn't and Charles knows it and IMO the Queen does too.

It seems many of us have thought about the somewhat precarious situation of the monarchy, and the royals are certainly trying to adapt to the times. You are probably quite right that the Queen frets a bit about it. Precarious is too strong a word, but I can't think of the right one!

wannable · July 25, 2019, 04:03:49 PM

Present and beyond (who/what you would like the monarchy versus a republic when Charles is King), the latest Mori/YouGov polls/surveys the monarchist from 2015 to 2019 remain is landslide majority. Only 3% have it as a priority to abolish.

Princess Cassandra · July 25, 2019, 04:04:28 PM

Quote from: TLLK on July 25, 2019, 02:55:25 PM
Yes. This is a well run machine and they've prepared as best they can IMO for when QEII's reign ends and other possibilities.

Yes, I am pretty sure that the Queen is quite happy to continue with the current plan, and the real question is how to support the POW, who clearly doesn't appear to me to feel the need for it. During the 70th birthday documentary William discussed how healthy the POW is, but that they (he, his brother and probably others) have been trying to take more time for leisure, saying that he was a wonderful grandfather and loves the time with his grandchildren. He indicated that they were all trying to convince him to take more time with them. That said a lot to me. But clearly he is full of ideas and isn't in a slowing down frame of mind.

Double post auto-merged: July 25, 2019, 04:08:13 PM

Quote from: wannable on July 25, 2019, 04:03:49 PM
Present and beyond (who/what you would like the monarchy versus a republic when Charles is King), the latest Mori/YouGov polls/surveys the monarchist from 2015 to 2019 remain is landslide majority. Only 3% have it as a priority to abolish.

That is good news! And I've had another thought since I posted on Curryong's quote. Edward VII was very unpopular as POW, but when he became king he very quickly became appreciated.

Double post auto-merged: July 25, 2019, 04:09:22 PM

Quote from: amabel on July 25, 2019, 03:08:53 PM
I think it helps hat the queen has such excellent healtlh. She is harldly ever ill and has only been in hospital maybe twice In her life. SO while the children and grandchildren are helping, she is not giving up her work

You are so right, Amabel!

TLLK · July 25, 2019, 08:30:30 PM

QuoteAll I'm saying is that there may well be a lot of discussion as to what kind of a monarchy is wanted or needed after Elizabeth.

:nod:

Which I believe is a discussion that will happen not only in the UK but throughout the Commonwealth nations too ie Australia which have the British monarch as their HoS.

Having seen many changes in the various monarchies via deaths or abdications in the 21st there always seems to be some discussion about the following:
1. Keeping or ending the monarchy-With the exception of Nepal (entire royal family murdered) these have by and large been very peaceful handovers. What seems to be the greatest concern now is just "relevance" to the European monarchies even in nations like Sweden where the heir is very popular.
2. Discussion on the suitability and preparedness of the adult heir especially in a hereditary monarchy.
3. If the monarchy is retained, who besides the monarch/consort/heir are going to be official representatives who are funded by the state for their duties. In Spain and the NL this is outlined in the constitution. In the other nations, it's not quite spelled out "who does what, when and where."

For someone like Elizabeth who has seen so many of her peers leave their thrones in recent years and have been replaced by their heirs, she must have so many diverse thoughts and feelings on this topic. This isn't the NL where every 30-40 years, a relatively quiet and easy abdication occurs in which the monarch can sit back and enjoy their retirement while offering the occasional bit of advice if solicited. By contrast this isn't Spain either which saw a once very popular monarch take a steep tumble that threw the future of the monarchy into question.

Glad that I'm not sitting in her seat. :notamused:

Curryong · July 26, 2019, 07:08:02 AM

As I've said before, TLLK, while there is tremendous respect for the Queen in Australasia, (Aus and New Zealiand) I don't necessarily believe that feeling for the Crown will last much beyond the end of Queen Elizabeth's reign.

Let's put it this way. IMO the chances of William becoming HOS of the major Realms in say twenty years as they are now constituted is less than zero. Nor do I believe that he will inherit his father's position as Honorary Head of the Commonwealth.

IMO the position was handed to Charles not so much on merit (though he is a hard worker and frequent traveller around the Commonwealth) but because of the respect and admiration the Govt heads have for the Queen. The knew she would have been terribly disappointed if another choice had been proposed and they didn't want that. However, that will not continue in the future.

The present POW is not popular in Australia or New Zealand really, there is little affection or respect for him, and I do believe that these two realms will become republics in Charles's reign. And as for Canada a couple of Canadian royalists admitted to me that if a referendum was able to be tabled then the result could go either way. The Commonwealth of Nations will remain as a unifier but the transferring of the Realms into republics will necessarily give a different slant to that organisation's affairs.