Camilla-The good, the bad and everything in-between

[TLLK]

The good-Projects a warm personality, puts others at ease, enjoys country life and activities, has championed formerly "taboo" charities with domestic violence and former sex trade workers

The bad-known adulterer, indifferent to the feelings of her lover's wife, smoker, poorly educated

The in-between- Has osteoporosis, easy going personality, mother and grandmother/step-grandmother,

[Curryong]

The Good: A good social manner. Not afraid to let her hair down.

The Bad: Well, never letting go, even when she honourably should have. Disloyal.

The everything in between: Being able to read Charles's moods like a map.

It is very difficult to get examples of how Camilla first regarded Diana, whether she thought of her, as it has been said, as a mouselike person who wouldn't make waves should she and Charles continue their affair, or, as she later called her lover's wife, 'that ridiculous creature', presumably because Diana was trying to hold on to her husband  Charles's circle of friends protected them both through their affair and Bolland attempted to rebuild their reputation afterwards, trying to make Camilla seem palatable to the British public, no matter who else he threw under the bus in the attempt.

Few biographers have dared to criticise Camilla or her actions  because to do so would be to get on the wrong side of Charles, the future King, and have any contacts among his circle cut off if they wrote further books.

Therefore it is doubtful (at least in our lifetimes unless you are extremely young) that we will get concrete evidence, in the way of letters or memoirs, as to exactly when Camilla's love affair with the married Charles resumed, what arrangements they had if any early in the marriage to keep in touch, and what Camilla's view of her rival was.

Any author of a book fifty years from now examining anything about how these two behaved during the Wales marriage is likely to encounter burned documentation ordered by both before their deaths, stonewalling by librarians of the archives at Windsor Castle, and nobody who was in their circle still alive.

[royalanthropologist]

I think Camilla assumed that Diana was too young and naive to pose any threat to her. She imagined that Diana would either all in line or do the Queen Alexandra thing of suffering in silence. When Diana started to rebel, Camilla decided to systematically dismantle the marriage. Her biggest weapon was knowing Charles like the back of her mind and the shrewdness of experience.

As Diana lashed out in fury, Camilla presented a calm accepting influence. It is called manipulation but it is also very effective if you are dealing with an emotionally strung love rival.  Prior to 1992, I think Camilla was happy and willing to be the mistress. After Morton, she decided that mistress was not good enough since she was already exposed. The life of a princess is very tempting and many women would fall for it.

I am sure Camilla has her own strategy for keeping Charles at her side. It seems she just keeps quiet, remains friendly and asks for nothing. Charles then feels obligated to protect her from the world. The more people criticize Camilla, the more he is determined to give her the best lifestyle he could afford.  It is said that anyone who says something bad about Camilla is unlikely to ever be invited to Highgrove again and becomes a lifetime enemy.  That means that even friends who want to talk, know that to do so would ruin their chances of ever interacting with Charles again.

Sometimes when men are forbidden something, they become even more stubborn in pursuing. That is what happened to Charles. He is determined that Camilla will never be relegated to secondary status again. Even his own family know she is non-negotiable.

[Curryong]

And all the manipulation, the contempt for Diana, the strategies, were all admirable and we should clap and cheer her on, should we? Yes, it worked, with a weak man who enjoys being flattered and buttered up, with his ego stroked at every opportunity. However that sort of manoevring is neither honourable or right.

Camilla reminds me of those females who work behind other women's backs and whom you wouldn't trust within a mile of your husband. She wouldn't know what a sense of honour and decency was if it got up and hit her in the face!

Ernest Simpson's first wife once stated that Mrs S began by being charming and friendly, then borrowed things from her and then ended up taking over her husband. Somewhat different tactics but the same sort of person as Camilla, someone who stops at nothing, underneath.

[royalanthropologist]

I rather suspect that the people who live and work with Camilla have a somewhat different view of her. Her main detractor was Diana, for obvious reasons. In other spheres of life; Camilla has always found it very easy to make and maintain friends. She is still in touch with people she met when she was in school. Her relationships with her former husband, siblings and children are excellent.

If she was as bad as Curryong describes: she would be repelling people left, right and center. Feeling lonely or abandoned have never been traits of Camilla. She seems remarkably cheerful even when people say nasty things about her. At George or Charlotte's christening, I saw her chatting to the DOE of Edinburgh. Bear in mind that this man is considered to be one of the most difficult members of the royal family but they were getting on just fine. Camilla surely must be doing something right.

Even Harry said she was a wonderful woman and they "love her to bits". Not many step mothers can get such reviews from their step children, particularly given the circumstances.

[Curryong]

Neither Philip nor Harry have spouses for Camilla to manipulate. (And Harry spoke about Camilla once when he was 21. He's spoken admiringly about his mother one heck of a lot especially in the last few years.) I doubt that every person who meets Camilla loves her and some people are so unfeeling that they remain cheerful and happy no matter what they do to others.

As for Philip, did he not say in a letter to Diana (with whom he got on reasonably well for years) that he couldn't imagine anyone preferring Camilla to her?

[sandy]

I think Camilla assumed that Diana was too young and naive to pose any threat to her. She imagined that Diana would either all in line or do the Queen Alexandra thing of suffering in silence. When Diana started to rebel, Camilla decided to systematically dismantle the marriage. Her biggest weapon was knowing Charles like the back of her mind and the shrewdness of experience.

As Diana lashed out in fury, Camilla presented a calm accepting influence. It is called manipulation but it is also very effective if you are dealing with an emotionally strung love rival.  Prior to 1992, I think Camilla was happy and willing to be the mistress. After Morton, she decided that mistress was not good enough since she was already exposed. The life of a princess is very tempting and many women would fall for it.

I am sure Camilla has her own strategy for keeping Charles at her side. It seems she just keeps quiet, remains friendly and asks for nothing. Charles then feels obligated to protect her from the world. The more people criticize Camilla, the more he is determined to give her the best lifestyle he could afford.  It is said that anyone who says something bad about Camilla is unlikely to ever be invited to Highgrove again and becomes a lifetime enemy.  That means that even friends who want to talk, know that to do so would ruin their chances of ever interacting with Charles again.

Sometimes when men are forbidden something, they become even more stubborn in pursuing. That is what happened to Charles. He is determined that Camilla will never be relegated to secondary status again. Even his own family know she is non-negotiable.

Charles already preferred Camilla when he married Diana. He was dishonest with his bride. Camilla was and is a manipulative woman and knew how to pull the right strings. Camilla before Charles outed her as his mistress, was "safely" married and posed no threat to people like the Queen Mother. Camilla was reaping the rewards of being the Prince's mistress before he dated Diana. She had a lot at stake, if the marriage "took" she would be stuck with dull Andrew Parker Bowles. I think Camilla had great ambitions for herself and saw to it that she got them. She was nasty to Diana and wanted to be in "charge" even trying to "mother" Diana and "advise her" about Charles. I consider her a sneak/

One thing I approve of his her having the brains not to want to go to the Memorial Service for Diana. Charles was pushing her. The Queen did not want her to go. I placed an article in the Diana/daughter thread.

Charles is the future King don't forget. They don't badmouth Camilla because they want to say in good with the Prince of Wales. They are currying favor. If Camilla is "out" then they would rally around Charles. As Diana found out, they are Charles' friends not the wife's who is dispensable.
Camilla pulls out of Diana memorial on Queen's advice | Daily Mail Online

Alexandra never had to worry about a mistress of her husband's bad mouthing her or trying to usurp her place as hostess in a royal residence. Mistresses knew their places back then.

Don't think Camila was some passive thing, her letters show she was undermining the wife and she shows total lack of respect for Diana by sitting at her seat at hostess at Highgrove (while Diana was still Charles' wife). She did go to Stuart Higgins of the Sun for ten years. I think she's a sneak.

Double post auto-merged: May 05, 2017, 12:48:49 PM

I rather suspect that the people who live and work with Camilla have a somewhat different view of her. Her main detractor was Diana, for obvious reasons. In other spheres of life; Camilla has always found it very easy to make and maintain friends. She is still in touch with people she met when she was in school. Her relationships with her former husband, siblings and children are excellent.

If she was as bad as Curryong describes: she would be repelling people left, right and center. Feeling lonely or abandoned have never been traits of Camilla. She seems remarkably cheerful even when people say nasty things about her. At George or Charlotte's christening, I saw her chatting to the DOE of Edinburgh. Bear in mind that this man is considered to be one of the most difficult members of the royal family but they were getting on just fine. Camilla surely must be doing something right.

Even Harry said she was a wonderful woman and they "love her to bits". Not many step mothers can get such reviews from their step children, particularly given the circumstances.

There were people who worked for her husband that she saw off. Charles employee Elizabeth Buckanan was one she saw off. Charles would see Elizabeth socially and they got along well. Camilla had her sacked. Then there was Tiggy whom Camilla despised calling her the "help." She saw off Tiggy too. She did see the touchy feely pictures of Charles and Tiggy no doubt. Not every worker adored Camilla. Tiggy did not invite Camilla to her wedding even though she was Charles "girlfriend".

Camilla also is known to freeze out people who cross her like Mrs Van Cutsem. Diana and Tiggy also got in her way. ANd I think she saw Anna Wallace as a threat. She and Charles danced every dance and ignored Anna, Charles' girlfriend.  She did not act the safe married friend with Anna the way she did with Diana. I think she saw Anna as having the experience to give her a run for her money.

Harry has not spoken about Camilla since  2005. He has spoken countless times about his mother. I think he wanted to help his father with the "happy families" spin. The boys have a needy father.

[royalanthropologist]

Well they are a happy family. Please see my avatar picture. That does not speak to an unhappy family. So what if he last spoke about her in 2005? I would be surprised if Harry was spending all his time talking about his step mother. Naturally the boys would want to talk about their own mother.

The boys supported their father because they knew that Camilla was right for him. She was the one who was going to make him happy. It was ridiculous having an ageing bachelor king-in-waiting with a consort who was not acknowledged in public. Since marrying Camilla, Charles is like a different man. He is so much more relaxed than he ever was. I even find that the royal family is no longer portrayed as a dysfunctional bunch. They all get along just fine. Camilla is not a trouble maker or the man eater than people want to portray. She had one major adulterous affair. Some have had many, many more in their lifetime. 

Prince Phillips allegedly wrote that private letter (which Diana leaked to the public for her own purposes) before he had actually met or interacted with Camilla. Since then,  his views seem to have changed. That is what tends to happen with Camilla. Those who do not know her are happy to dislike her based on tabloid characterizations her but those who really know her have a very different reading of her personality. She is not prone to histrionics/ self-absorption and that can be a very attractive quality in a spouse/family member.

I also question the idea that APB is a dull man. He is not. In his day he was a real catch and even princess Anne was interested in him. Camilla's relationship with APB is a great example of how to behave when you divorce. APB actually married his long term mistress. Both C&C attended the wedding and her funeral after her untimely death.  APB was there at the royal weddings. That to me does not speak of a woman who is unpopular with the people in her circle. APB is certainly no bitter vengeful cuckold.

I remember a story that when the wedding was announced in 2005, there was simultaneous clapping amongst the staff. It was a far cry from the quarrels, tensions and divisions of the 1980s and 1990s. Camilla has been very good for Charles and he was an absolute fool not to marry her back in the 1970s. Had he married her, theirs would have been an exemplary royal marriage and the Windsors would not have suffered the blows the suffered during the wars of the waleses.

[Trudie]

Camilla the Good well the only thing I can say is she is a good mother who supports her children especially her son in his endeavors, loves her grandchildren and she loves animals.

In between there is none.

The bad she is the most scheming manipulator I have ever seen. Her desire was APB and she stopped at nothing to become his wife including dating Charles to make him jealous. Her desire for the top aristocratic lifestyle APB couldn't give her and his philandering Camilla became Charles mistress and ensured most of the women he dated were seen off until the sweet naive Diana came along. Camilla assuming Diana in her shyness was a complete mouse who would put up with whatever Charles wanted thought she would still be number one until Diana rebelled at sharing her husband. Her expertness at having excellent relationships now are IMO tied to her HRH. Face it everyone wants to be in with the number one family in the land having that social cachet. Emilie Van Cutsem in keeping with Royal Protocol sat the then Mrs Parker-Bowles apart from Charles at her sons wedding as The Queen was in attendance well doesn't that tell you how grand and above herself Camilla became after all it was Emilie who provided a safe house for her during the Wales marriage. To feel slighted over a minor seat because of protocol was no excuse to end the friendship but it had it's desired effect she soon got the ring from Charles.

[sandy]

Well they are a happy family. Please see my avatar picture. That does not speak to an unhappy family. So what if he last spoke about her in 2005? I would be surprised if Harry was spending all his time talking about his step mother. Naturally the boys would want to talk about their own mother.

The boys supported their father because they knew that Camilla was right for him. She was the one who was going to make him happy. It was ridiculous having an ageing bachelor king-in-waiting with a consort who was not acknowledged in public. Since marrying Camilla, Charles is like a different man. He is so much more relaxed than he ever was. I even find that the royal family is no longer portrayed as a dysfunctional bunch. They all get along just fine. Camilla is not a trouble maker or the man eater than people want to portray. She had one major adulterous affair. Some have had many, many more in their lifetime. 

Prince Phillips allegedly wrote that private letter (which Diana leaked to the public for her own purposes) before he had actually met or interacted with Camilla. Since then,  his views seem to have changed. That is what tends to happen with Camilla. Those who do not know her are happy to dislike her based on tabloid characterizations her but those who really know her have a very different reading of her personality. She is not prone to histrionics/ self-absorption and that can be a very attractive quality in a spouse/family member.

I also question the idea that APB is a dull man. He is not. In his day he was a real catch and even princess Anne was interested in him. Camilla's relationship with APB is a great example of how to behave when you divorce. APB actually married his long term mistress. Both C&C attended the wedding and her funeral after her untimely death.  APB was there at the royal weddings. That to me does not speak of a woman who is unpopular with the people in her circle. APB is certainly no bitter vengeful cuckold.

I remember a story that when the wedding was announced in 2005, there was simultaneous clapping amongst the staff. It was a far cry from the quarrels, tensions and divisions of the 1980s and 1990s. Camilla has been very good for Charles and he was an absolute fool not to marry her back in the 1970s. Had he married her, theirs would have been an exemplary royal marriage and the Windsors would not have suffered the blows the suffered during the wars of the waleses.

William and Harry don't live in a Brady Bunch household with Camilla. They are grownups and have their own households and William is very close to his wife's family.  Camilla never became a "mother figure" to them and never "replaced" Diana.

Why wouldn't the staff clap for Camilla. WOuld they have booed and gotten sacked.  According to Stephen Barry the staff gave parties for Diana as well and cheered her. The wives would get applauded.

I think Camilla is a trouble maker. That's how she got where she is today. If she had shown respect for Diana and backed off she would not have been a trouble maker and maybe have not gotten all the marbles.  Charles always had access to  Camilla for years. He was helping himself to happiness for years while both he and Camilla were married to others. She was not this little old lady who came back into his life. She was Always there and I mean Always.

Andrew Parker Bowles chose to be civilized and put up with his  wife's relationship with Charles. It benefitted him since he still is in royal circles. He tolerated the affair until Charles blabbed about it and APB would not tolerate the affair "going public." The custom in the royal family had been for the royal not to publicly confess to an affair with a mistress. Edward VIII did not blab that he was involved with Wallis until the "woman I love" speech when she was already divorced. Ernest Simpson took the blame for the divorce and thus she did not have to go to court and admit she cheated on her husband with the Prince of Wales, later KIng.

I notice a pattern Charles fans seem obsessed with the man being made happy. In his quest for happiness he made many people unhappy. Lady Diana was entitled to happiness to but Charles married her under false pretenses, knowing he never could love her.

[Duch_Luver_4ever]

I think like the DoE, shes an old lady and doesnt she deserve to have her faults smoothed over and wished a happy old age and leisure time????

[royalanthropologist]

There comes a time when you have to let go. Same old, same old. Man leaves wife for mistress, the world comes to an end....NOT.  :no:

[sandy]

Well I notice you are still posting praising Charles and finding much fault with Diana. So please, no lectures.

[FanDianaFancy]

Good-Devoted, good mother and grandmother  and  mother-in-law, daughter,  sister-in-law, sister,  best friends with  ex husband  , friend  to  all who dare not cross her. Lively  personality. Always  had  fun at  parties,  always had boyfriends. Powerful  as Mrs. CPB  and  now, of course, as  Duchess. Smart  as in worldy, confidant, greed,  aggressive.
Bad-maniupluater. Destroyed with glee and selfish , personal reasons a  then young girl's  life, hope, dreams. As well as she did  this and she did, yet she did nit act alone,  imagine if  she  had  encouraged PC  to  go to  , be  with,  love Diana?  He  would have. She has that  hold  and control over  him.  Some people  do  have  a  hold and control over  others.  Go figure!!   Camilla  his anny  looking  longtime, comfort  girlfriend  during the 1970, 80s, and  90s  was  always  there. ALWAYS!!!

Grey-there is no area with  Camilla.

Double post auto-merged: May 06, 2017, 06:28:43 PM

Well they are a happy family. Please see my avatar picture. That does not speak to an unhappy family. So what if he last spoke about her in 2005? I would be surprised if Harry was spending all his time talking about his step mother. Naturally the boys would want to talk about their own mother.

The boys supported their father because they knew that Camilla was right for him. She was the one who was going to make him happy. It was ridiculous having an ageing bachelor king-in-waiting with a consort who was not acknowledged in public. Since marrying Camilla, Charles is like a different man. He is so much more relaxed than he ever was. I even find that the royal family is no longer portrayed as a dysfunctional bunch. They all get along just fine. Camilla is not a trouble maker or the man eater than people want to portray. She had one major adulterous affair. Some have had many, many more in their lifetime. 

Prince Phillips allegedly wrote that private letter (which Diana leaked to the public for her own purposes) before he had actually met or interacted with Camilla. Since then,  his views seem to have changed. That is what tends to happen with Camilla. Those who do not know her are happy to dislike her based on tabloid characterizations her but those who really know her have a very different reading of her personality. She is not prone to histrionics/ self-absorption and that can be a very attractive quality in a spouse/family member.

I also question the idea that APB is a dull man. He is not. In his day he was a real catch and even princess Anne was interested in him. Camilla's relationship with APB is a great example of how to behave when you divorce. APB actually married his long term mistress. Both C&C attended the wedding and her funeral after her untimely death.  APB was there at the royal weddings. That to me does not speak of a woman who is unpopular with the people in her circle. APB is certainly no bitter vengeful cuckold.

I remember a story that when the wedding was announced in 2005, there was simultaneous clapping amongst the staff. It was a far cry from the quarrels, tensions and divisions of the 1980s and 1990s. Camilla has been very good for Charles and he was an absolute fool not to marry her back in the 1970s. Had he married her, theirs would have been an exemplary royal marriage and the Windsors would not have suffered the blows the suffered during the wars of the waleses.

Where to start?

Happy  family...NOT!!  That  is a  picture  from a  BRF public event, as they all are,   where all the cast  of characters  are  on best behavior in each's  role  and  acting accordingly to the script.
FACTS---PW  is very close to Mom and  Dad. THE MIDDLETONS.  So it was leaked that  PC  , sources of sources   said, he  does  not  get to see his grandchildren enough. I posted back then  when that lil gem of a  story  hit,  it  was  not  good  of  PW  to have the boy, cannot remember of PChar  was born yet  or was still an infant.  There is only one person in the world  to  guide  PG along  in  childhood  at  every  step  BRF and that is  Charles.  Only Charles can  guide  PW  along  with some  things  BRF  still.

Camilas'  kids and PH and W  do not seem too  much like good  pals, buds, besties, friends.
Camilla is cool, friendly, in control always of her life and very happy  ...like Kate ...like Sophie. Why  should she resort to  bouts of temper tantrums, etc. She  is  queen  in waiting.  She  has  all  she  wants and then some.  She  got it all and even by  luck and default-D's death  . Diana  dying was like  a  Godsend. A  most  unforeseen, never imagined  surprise in life.  lets be honest.  I am not  saying Camilla /Charles wished  D's death. NO!! However, it  was a  gift !!!

No children  prefer their parents  to  be  divorced. All kids , young and old wish  for their  parents to  be happy, right for  each  other and to each other.  REREAD that.

Acceptance. Yes. What  can  PW and PH do, could have  done, will  do about  their father and Camilla? Nothing but live their lives and that  they  are. PW has  a  wife, two kids, his work,  his  very close sister-in-laws  wedding, new  brother-in-law in  James Matthews...whew!!
PH  has  a  serious  thing with MM a, work,  friends, travels, etc.

APB and Camilla had a  wonderful marriage and  are  still just best friends. YES. It was their marriage by their rules and it worked well for  them. Having wife as mistress worked  well  then  for APB and now,  Camilla as  D, queen  in waiting,  his live is enriched  by knowing his children, grandchildren  are  well  taken care of. They already  , T and L, have trusts  set  up by PCharles. His life has always  benefitted from sharing  Camilla with  PC.  ABP was never  c(*&^%$ by  Camilla. It  was a  great agreement between  him and Camilla and  APB. Please,  bed my wife  Sir.    Alice Kreppels '  family did very  well in perks  for  laying down  for  HRH.

Problem was  PD did  not want to a  part of  the   foursome. She did not want to play. She wanted to make the  rules of the game and  mess up everybody's apple cart. I have always said if  Diana  would have  played  , then she  and PC would married today,  C and APB  married still today.... least  all  so in public and legal paper.

The claps, supports whatever  the family  f the  estate  does  upstairs. That is how it works. The  quarrels would not have been  if  PC Fred and Camilla Gladys  would have  not  keep on their affair. See my post above.
PCharles could  have married her  in the 1970's  if he had really wanted to. Soveregin gets  just about everything they  want.  Camilla was not  Mrs. Simpson.  PC  was  a  young  man, world reknown,  a  prince  and not ready  for marriage to Camilla  or anyone. Only after  30, 31, did he decide to work on  his other  BRF duty, securing his line  and with  Camilla's help, they found the perfect specimen for him to mate with.