Who got the better deal? Will or Har. Who gets the better deal? Heir or spare.

[FanDianaFancy]

Definitely, yes up to the individuals.  Crown Princess Victoria s sibling?s seem content with her being in the hot seat.

They support. 

[dianab]

^Victoria and her siblings have always had a good and close relationship. Nothing to compare with the crazy Windsors.

Saying that, it's obvious the spares have the best deal... since they have a good head on the shoulders like Anne - who with all her faults knows self pity wont take her to any (good) place... but the spare decides to be a public mess (like magaret and harry) and just blame the press (or whoever/whatever)  for their own mistakes... life isnt not easy...

any public figure who just blames the press or others for their own shortcomings is going have a tough life.
Double post auto-merged: March 19, 2020, 07:08:19 PM

Yes @Princess Cassandra - The entire BRF has been known to make use of private planes and commercial (especially for long haul travel ie: Australia).

Back to the topic of "Who gets the better deal?" I still believe it's up to the individuals involved and their personal views on the matter. :shrug:
More than one "spare" has made it known that they're  very content not being the future monarch ie: the late Prince Friso and Prince Constantijn of the NL.

The Scandinavian royal familes appears me to be much more put together people than the windsors.

Prince Joachim of Denmark is another one, no? His 1rst wife was a absolute success as a royal. Currently, i understand he and his french wife are on good terms with Mary and Fred and have made their own life - dont have ill feelings for which is their situation.

[Trudie]

^Victoria and her siblings have always had a good and close relationship. Nothing to compare with the crazy Windsors.

Saying that, it's obvious the spares have the best deal... since they have a good head on the shoulders like Anne - who with all her faults knows self pity wont take her to any (good) place... but the spare decides to be a public mess (like magaret and harry) and just blame the press (or whoever/whatever)  for their own mistakes... life isnt not easy...

any public figure who just blames the press or others for their own shortcomings is going have a tough life.
Double post auto-merged: March 19, 2020, 07:08:19 PM
The Scandinavian royal familes appears me to be much more put together people than the windsors.

Prince Joachim of Denmark is another one, no? His 1rst wife was a absolute success as a royal. Currently, i understand he and his french wife are on good terms with Mary and Fred and have made their own life - dont have ill feelings for which is their situation.

I hate to point this out to you but the only spare to be a public mess is Andrew unlike Margaret and Harry, Andrew has the most questionable morals his friendships and shady business deals go over and above anything Margaret or Harry have done.

[dianab]

I forgot mention Andrew. As it's Anne who was born right after Charles. But that dont changes my opinon about Margaret and Harry.

Probably "a mess" dont describes Andrew as he in fact deserves... more like a low life, at least, to me

Anne is the best spare of this family.

[Curryong]

There reportedly have been many undercurrents in the Swedish Royal family, and with the Danes as well. King Carl Gustav's behaviour has caused scandal in the past. There were reports of Queen Sylvia criticising Victoria's appetite and looks, comparing her two daughters. Victoria got an eating disorder. Their brother has been criticised as lazy and spoiled. His father still has lingering resentments about him not being Crown Prince. Madeleine has spent years, since she married, with her husband and children in Britain and the US.

As for the Danes, Queen Daisy's late husband Henri, a proud Frenchman himself, got on notably better with the French Marie, Joachim's second wife, than with the Aussie Crown Princess Mary. There's a Royal forum around that specialised in pointing out all the cold moments between Mary and Marie. That was ridiculous IMO  but I have to say I've never noticed any special closeness between Fred and Joachim in recent decades.

The BRF is a family that are prestigious and known throughout the world. The British tabloids watch all senior members like Hawks at all times. Any sign of discord between them, whether real or not, gets reported around the world and almost always has. Everything with them is magnified a thousand times. Members of the family have spoken about the effect of living under a microscope. That is very different to how the Swedish and Danish Press report their RFs nor how their families live. 

There is an extra element in that, amid that spotlight,  some members of the BRF are more popular with the public than others, leading to jealousies between the various households. No other RF organises engagements etc with up to three different Royal Households.
Double post auto-merged: March 19, 2020, 08:53:27 PM

I forgot mention Andrew. As it's Anne who was born right after Charles. But that dont changes my opinon about Margaret and Harry.

Probably "a mess" dont describes Andrew as he in fact deserves... more like a low life, at least, to me

Anne is the best spare of this family.

Anne isn't a spare. If by some tragedy the entire Wales family were wiped out the throne would go to Andrew and then Beatrice, not to Anne and then Peter, in spite of recent legislation which moved second born females up due to Charlotte's prospective birth. That was not made retrospective however.

[dianab]

There reportedly have been many undercurrents in the Swedish Royal family, and with the Danes as well. King Carl Gustav's behaviour has caused scandal in the past. There were reports of Queen Sylvia criticising Victoria's appetite and looks, comparing her two daughters. Victoria got an eating disorder. Their brother has been criticised as lazy and spoiled. His father still has lingering resentments about him not being Crown Prince. Madeleine has spent years, since she married, with her husband and children in Britain and the US.

As for the Danes, Queen Daisy's late husband Henri, a proud Frenchman himself, got on notably better with the French Marie, Joachim's second wife, than with the Aussie Crown Princess Mary. There's a Royal forum around that specialised in pointing out all the cold moments between Mary and Marie. That was ridiculous IMO  but I have to say I've never noticed any special closeness between Fred and Joachim in recent decades.

i believe it was the past year i saw a video of mary and fred going to joachim and marie and kissed and hugged them at gala/reception and spent some time with them. what i saw betwenn them is nothing compared to  the obvious bad stuff going on between the cambs and sussex.

as for king karl gustav... it's well known the 'rumours' around old phil and stuff that is fact about him and his darling uncle mountbatten.

from which i know silvia was and is been always very supportive of her daughters and son. and was genuinely concerned about victoria and her anorexia during her teens.

i think she's a great mom. i know she's a strict mom as i remember madeleine saying as silvia was against her living together with her boyfriend and doing stuff that girls her age (early 20s) were doing.

i've seen silvia in interviews and she has warmth. one thing  that  QE dont remotely knows what it means.

i know the scandinavian families arent trouble-free... no family or human are.

elizabeth windsor and (most of) her family really live in lalala land.

i've also found great as queen marg of denmark attended to 2nd of of her former daughter-in-law alexandra.
Double post auto-merged: March 20, 2020, 01:44:43 AM

iirc queen marg of denmark attended to 2nd wedding of of her former daughter-in-law alexandra. she handled the joachim's divorce much better. and as she treated alexandra post-divorce is commendable imo
Double post auto-merged: March 20, 2020, 01:47:13 AM

The Windsors must to be most famous and pretigious royal family ever.... but goodness their personal relations is disastrous. they dont have a clue what means class and elegance! let alone human relations...

[PaulaB]

I think Harry May come back to the royal family after all this ends.  He had a small window of opportunity to make money as an ex royal before wills kids start getting more attention the whole pandemic will shut that window down all together.  When we do get through it the news will be about that not Harry and his wife.  Then what happens just a petulant pair who threw the baby out with the bath water.

[QueenAlex]

I think Harry May come back to the royal family after all this ends.  He had a small window of opportunity to make money as an ex royal before wills kids start getting more attention the whole pandemic will shut that window down all together.  When we do get through it the news will be about that not Harry and his wife.  Then what happens just a petulant pair who threw the baby out with the bath water.

I think that it has shut the window down.  by the time all this finishes.. lets hope within a year, I think that the public wil have forgotten bout Harry or be fed up with him.. and Meghan.  So what will he do then?  He may come back but I rally don't know if Meg will want to  do so.  But she may do so for financial reasons.

[Nightowl]

The issue with Harry and Meghan is now ...just what are they going to do to make money?  They have said they want financial independence, so what jobs are there for them?  So they create some type of new foundation that is not called a foundation yet what will it be?  I do not see Meghan going back to acting at all for that was just her way of supporting herself and her interests.  What can Harry do? Talk about his mother ...that gets really really old fast and just about the entire world has heard all about Diana from the day she was born to the day she left the earth......we know everything or just about everything there is to know about her.......so what is left?  Harry flew a helicopter ......does he still have flying time to do so yet?  Neither have done much in the sense of making millions of dollars to live on .....all there money is what Meghan earned as an actress (say 5 million) and the rest is what Harry inherited from family.......even royals could live a pretty darn fabulous life with that kind of money yet these 2 have a what is called a *large lifestyle* to support.......and security is a whole other issue besides daily living expenses.  This virus has taken over the world and it has put a huge stop watch on the lives of millions of people including Harry and Meghan......so I think their so called window of opportunity in being free agents is gone ......and if things do not change in the next year, then they just might have to return to the royal family even if they do no events, at least they will be in the family where they will be safe and secure and like before everything in life handed to them on a *gold platter*, not silver mind you for gold is more expensive. That there will be the real test of their marriage. 

As for William.....maybe at some point in his life he also wanted out, yet now more then ever and most surly with Catherine  he has found a foothold into this future as king.....he knows just what to do and how to do it and has the support of his wife and family....he has a huge responsibility because of his children and he damn well knows what is more important in life then anything else.  I think William has come to terms with his life and what is expected of him and he knows he can have a strong positive effect on the lives of his country men and women....that right there tells me that William is much more mature and level headed then Harry who still has lots of growing up to do and to finally face what is going on with him instead of hiding behind his mother's death.  His therapy just does not seem to be working for him after 7 years .........believe me I know all about therapy and facing issues that hurt and can not be healed in a time line....yet you can move on and face life head on.  Harry needs to do that now.....maybe this is the time for him to do so......hopefully for him and Meghan and their son.

[FanDianaFancy]

I think Harry May come back to the royal family after all this ends.  He had a small window of opportunity to make money as an ex royal before wills kids start getting more attention the whole pandemic will shut that window down all together.  When we do get through it the news will be about that not Harry and his wife.  Then what happens just a petulant pair who threw the baby out with the bath water.

I think that it has shut the window down.  by the time all this finishes.. lets hope within a year, I think that the public wil have forgotten bout Harry or be fed up with him.. and Meghan.  So what will he do then?  He may come back but I rally don't know if Meg will want to  do so.  But she may do so for financial reasons.

The window is closed.
Are they in or out?
They are out.
Were they given everything?
Yes they had big turnouts for tours, great patronages, and much great press. The wedding was the grandest.

They are not going back.

Henry might have to one day with his tail between his legs. Meaghn is never going back. That BRF hats and fascinations and protocols and not be freely able to publicly do what you want is just so unAmerican and not for her.

She loved the perks and HRH, stuff like that.
The rest of it, you can stuff it.

Meghan is never going back. Her moves with her, naturally.
If they stay married and Henry runs back from time to time  for 2-4 days for his ego feelings of Prince Harry, then that is on him.

[sandy]

I think that it has shut the window down.  by the time all this finishes.. lets hope within a year, I think that the public wil have forgotten bout Harry or be fed up with him.. and Meghan.  So what will he do then?  He may come back but I rally don't know if Meg will want to  do so.  But she may do so for financial reasons.

I doubt it. They are still getting thousands of comments on DM. He won't leave his wife and child.

[FanDianaFancy]

@Nightowl , well said.
Again, though, no going back for Meghan. Also remember, Harry?s words of his had to leave it all of his country, his family, and those duties to protect his son. I am still puzzled on that. How so? Who was ,MyGod, going to harm his son? PC, Louis , QE, maybe PP,lol.

[QueenAlex]

I doubt it. They are still getting thousands of comments on DM. He won't leave his wife and child.

So what if they need to come back for financial reasons but Meg still does not want to come?  What are they going to do?  I think Meg will do whatever  she feels she needs to do, but if thngs change, if the financial crisis eases off, she may want to be back in America again.  I think Harry if he comes home, wont want to go back....

[sandy]

I don't think they will break up. I do think something bothered him enough to leave. She was not the only one in on the decision IMO. Harry would never separate from his family, I just can't see him doing that.

[QueenAlex]

I don't think they will break up. I do think something bothered him enough to leave. She was not the only one in on the decision IMO. Harry would never separate from his family, I just can't see him doing that.

And what if he wants to come home, or they have to come home because of finances?  I don't think Meg ever wants to live in England again.  Harry is probably more ambivalent.  So will he stay with her?  If they have to come home, will she come with him?

[sandy]

Rather than separate, they would as a couple work things out so they can be together. They have money and they won't starve. Harry did not appear ambivalent to me, if he were he would not have made the move to leave. Home for Harry IMO is with Meghan  and Archie IMO. I did not see them get a great reception from William and Kate, I doubt Harry would want to go back under those conditions.

[QueenAlex]

Rather than separate, they would as a couple work things out so they can be together. They have money and they won't starve. Harry did not appear ambivalent to me, if he were he would not have made the move to leave. Home for Harry IMO is with Meghan  and Archie IMO. I did not see them get a great reception from William and Kate, I doubt Harry would want to go back under those conditions.

Then he will have to cut his coat according to his cloth.  Learn to live on the income that he has.  And still he will probably have to go to Charles for help with security.  In fact I don't know how they will do security which might involve his staff working shifts and travelling....

[Nightowl]

Oh here is a thought and shot me if you must.......Harry and Meghan can set up a TV show selling that very very expensive wardrobe that was likely paid for by Charles with all the shoes and purses and gads....the coats to make money, like QVC......I seriously doubt we will ever see any of those clothes again in her lifetime or ours for that matter........ :tomato:

[QueenAlex]

Oh here is a thought and shot me if you must.......Harry and Meghan can set up a TV show selling that very very expensive wardrobe that was likely paid for by Charles with all the shoes and purses and gads....the coats to make money, like QVC......I seriously doubt we will ever see any of those clothes again in her lifetime or ours for that matter........ :tomato:

Royal women apparently often sell their "fancy clothes" which they cant' use too often, in second hand shops.. Diana did so... and so does the queen and other royals.  I disagree that we'll never see the dresses again.. Im sure there will be occasions when she can wear them.

[Nightowl]

Okay ladies, you got me for I did not know royal ladies sold their clothes to 2nd hand shops????? Now that took me by surprise......you mean to say HM sells her dresses and hats........good grief.......let me buy a hat of her's and where.  I have yet to see any normal ordinary woman in any clothes that was worn by any royal woman out there. So where do they sell their clothes and hats and purses for I want to go shopping there so see if I can afford something as I am not related to T***p.   Show me pictures of people wearing a dress of HM or Camilla or Mary of Denmark or any woman who is a royal woman.   Goodness the 2nd hand shops would be booming with business if Mary sold her clothes.......I want beige evening dress she wore to Frederik's 50th BD party.....and Catherine's fabulous red Scottish coat and that hat Catherine wore to church with HM.

[QueenAlex]

You mean
Who said Meghan's clothes were always ultra expensive? The Oh so reliable Fail, who often calculated jewellery like her engagement ring in their totals? Many of her outfits may well have been borrowed anyway. Or paid for during her engagement with her own money.

Double post auto-merged: March 23, 2020, 07:46:54 AM

And why the speculation on this forum that Harry will want to return and Meghan won't? Where I'd there the slightest bit of evidence anywhere that this couple is unhappy together or don't want to live together, or don't back each other up to the hilt in everything they do?

Links please to any viable article  that gives evidence to the contrary.

I'm sure that some would be absolutely delighted at news of a divorce, or Harry coming back to Britain with his tail between his legs begging to join the RF again. No sign of it, at all.

At the moment they are newly married and I'd expect them to back each other up.  But I don't think ti was Harry's dream to go to Canada.. and I don't think that Meg will ever want to live in the UK again.  So what happens if their money making plans don't pan out and they have to consider returning to the UK?  I think Meg would do it if really pushed, but she would not be happy.  Harry I think would be more ambivalent.. It seems quite natural to me that he would be more ambivalent.  Its his home, he hasn't as yet probably put down roots in Canada.
Double post auto-merged: March 23, 2020, 10:39:28 AM

Okay ladies, you got me for I did not know royal ladies sold their clothes to 2nd hand shops????? Now that took me by surprise......you mean to say HM sells her dresses and hats........good grief.......let me buy a hat of her's and where.  I have yet to see any normal ordinary woman in any clothes that was worn by any royal woman out there. So w

According to some book I've read, apparently Diana sold quite a few of her dresses and got herself some ready cash.  And it was commented on that other royal women sell stuff as well.. it is probably a condition of selling that its handled discreetly and the shops don't sell the stuff on with "worn by HM the queen".. and they're probably altered before re sale.   they are not going to be in a shop that's affordable by ordinary people... and they will still be expensive..  so its not likely you can buy someone's former dress. 
It makes sense. In olden days even rich women revamped their clothes, cut them up and made new ones...

[QueenAlex]

Diana sold her dresses For Charity not for "ready cash." She had a large divorce settlement and would be working with financial advisers about the best way to invest. Diana was not poverty stricken so she had to sell her clothes. It is a well known fact that it was for CHarity.

william and Kate were very cold to Harry and Meghan. Harry may have been sick of this and wanted to leave. Why would he leave his wife and son to be with his brother and sister in law who treated him so coldly?

no this is a separate thing.  according I think to Ken Wharfe she sold her clothes and got some ready cash, selling her gowns for charity was a differetn thng.  And apparently a lot of royal women do this, sell to a discreet second hand establishment.  There is a limit how often they can re cycle the clothes, so why not?
Why would Harry come back?  Well perhaps he will not be able to make a living in Canada and will have to return as it is cheaper to pay for his security if he live in frogmore than if he lives abroad. 

[wannable]

Harry (and Meghan) Got the better deal.  Financial Independence or not, the BRF will not have it - a family member and his family living like paupers way under their 'living standards'.  It will never happen.

Harry will always be provided by Charles, then William, then George.  The Agreements, NDA's and the what the spare what NOT to do to receive the allowance flow is private, but usually an educated guess or full blown facts in time is disclosed.

These agreements can be studied in the matters of historical royals who abdicated, were banned, were spares, etc.  None of them lived under or badly from the aristocratic living standards, their reputation questioned, that's it.  Of course, Reputation is All in my World, but then, if that is lost, live as materialistic well as possible.

[sandy]

I don't see why Harry's "reputation" would be questioned.  I think the royals have some share of the blame.

[QueenAlex]

Ken Wharfe wrote this after she died. She was not around to refute it.

Why would he say this if it wasn't true?  Its not a story about sex, wich he might exaggerate.  If the queen etc does it, I don't see why Diana should not do it.
Double post auto-merged: March 23, 2020, 01:33:25 PM

I don't see why Harry's "reputation" would be questioned.  I think the royals have some share of the blame.

Did they tell him to walk out?  QUite the contrary, I would say.  And they may be the ones who have to try and support him financially, no matter what.