Royal Insight Forum

Since TLLK is no longer allowed to post engagement tallies from outside sources, I thought it would be helpful to keep a running list of all Royal engagements done by Will, Kate, and Harry (the Royals who garner the most discussion on this topic).

My criteria is simple:  it must be an engagement on behalf of the BRF (outside work will not be included).  I'll be working off the Court Circular (both online and where I can find details about the paper copy, as the former is never fully complete).  I will also include things that appear to be in a Royal capacity but that the BRF did not deem an official engagement (such as private visits), but I will asterisk those so the distinction is clear.

Beyond that, I'm not making any judgments; I'll list out each engagement separately and then people can make their own counts using whatever criteria they want (not counting airport arrivals/departures, counting days worked instead of engagements, multiplying Harry's count by three and dividing Kate's by two, etc.).

I'll update once or twice a month so as not to have a million posts here every time one of them goes to something.  I'm sure I'll miss some since the online CC is so patchy, so please let me know if I do.

The list so far:

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
February 1: RFU injured players training session

Thank you for providing us with an accurate account of the trio's engagements. Everything you have listed coordinates with the CC and thank you for noting Harry's French Embassy visit even though it did not register with the CC.

@Canuck Thanks very much!

Worth noting that this morning he spent about an hour at Twickenham Rugby Stadium to attend a London marathon training day. Kensington Palace on Twitter: "Prince Harry meets members of the #charitiesforum at the #LondonMarathon training day http://t.co/EMDutDRXd8" (https://twitter.com/KensingtonRoyal/status/561886477207232514)

Too soon to know if it'll be on the CC or not.

Adrienne, was that a different event than the RFU (Rugby foundation) training that happened today?  I thought they were the same event.

No, you're right. I was originally misreading the RFU event as the 29Jan events. :)

You stated that arrivals and departures will not be included.  Will you make an exception for when the arrival is an official one - such as the arrival in New Zealand where there were officials there that greeted W&K?  Those events did take some time and were obviously important to the country they were visiting.

I agree that the entries on the CC that "X arrived back to Britain etc etc " aren't engagements.  It is just a notation on the CC.

Actually, I'm planning to include all of the things in the CC, including the arrival/departure notes.  People can then make their own counts and decide for themselves which, if any, of those things they want to include.

 :thumbsup:

Thanks Canuck.  You are a doll. :hug:

Thank you, Canuck.  :flower:

Cindy

Perhaps you've missed the point of this one.  I'm listing everything the BRF considers to be Royal work (and also listing, with an asterisk, anything that appears to be Royal work but that the BRF did not count).  People then have complete, accurate information about the total possible universe of Royal work done by the trio, and can use it to make their own determinations as to how much of the BRF's definition of Royal work they agree should be counted.  I personally find that a lot more informative than a list that has been pre-selected in accordance with one poster's views.

Good job, @Canuck. I appreciate it since I rarely keep track of the actual numbers.

Thanks for this, Canuck. It will be interesting to look through as a whole at the end of the year, too.

---

Double post auto-merged: February 01, 2015, 08:02:01 PM

---

Just as a suggestion, perhaps the list could be placed under January, February etc? It might be easier that way to total it up when it gets to December.

I like that suggestion, Curryong.  When I do an update later this month, I'll split the engagements by month to make them easier to count.

Thank you Canuck for doing that as I agree it will be easier to read the facts that way.

We're about halfway through the month, so I thought this would be a good time for an update.

A couple of notes:

• I added Harry's meeting with the ice cap challenge team back in January.  I can't tell whether that was Royal work or army work (it's supported by the Royal Foundation and the KP twitter account tweeted the photo as part of a larger series on Royal support for expeditions, but it doesn't appear in the CC/wasn't announced like other Royal work and it happened at Whitehall where Harry's army job is), but I figured I'd stick it on the list and people can count it or not as they like
• Kate's meeting on palliative care this week isn't in the online CC so I've also asterisked that for now.  But since that meeting *was* announced by KP, that may just be one of the online CC's many glitches -- if it shows up later or someone finds it in the print CC, I'll change it
• the CC is actually listing 3 engagements for Kate yesterday:  she first made a private visit to the current Ben Ainslie facility (no media because they were actually showing her their racing technology, which obviously they don't want their competitors to get wind of), then the visit to the building site of the new facility (where she painted and talked to the student artists and construction workers), and finally the reception in the Spinnaker tower (where she met with community leaders and students/teachers at a local college).  From what I can see those are all separate venues (the first is several towns away, the second two are both in the port but she needed to be driven between them) with separate participants, so I've gone with the separate listing the CC has

The updated list:

JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
None

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit (not open to media)
*February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley (not open to media)
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program

That's excellent, Canuck. Very good work! :thumbsup:
I wonder when we'll see William begin his royal engagements for 2015? In March?

Good question.  He's done some non-engagement stuff (the piece he wrote for Holocaust Memorial Day, the video tribute at the BAFTAs), but since the public/press really focus on engagements as the measure of Royal work I'm surprised he hasn't done one or two just to keep himself out there.  I've seen a few reporters mentioning it on twitter recently, so I'd guess we'll see him at something in the next couple of weeks.

Thank you Canuck for keeping us updated on the trio's engagements. I have to wonder if William is just trying to cram in exams before the China/Japan Tour and baby Cambridge's debut?

I'm sure he is, but given the optics of taking time off for vacation, I think making time for one or two engagements would be advisable at this point.

Quote from: Canuck on February 13, 2015, 08:59:06 PM
I'm sure he is, but given the optics of taking time off for vacation, I think making time for one or two engagements would be advisable at this point.

I kinda agree with you.  But KP has told us what he would be doing at this time so it isn't surprising to me that we aren't seeing him.  But maybe just one or two might not be a bad idea.

Thanks for doing this!  I like the idea of just listing the events.  That gives us a neutral record of activities and allows everyone to determine their own count.

Personally, I am giving Wills one event for the pre recorded message.  Something like that does take some time to plan, organize and record.  And it was done for one of his charities.

Quote from: SophieChloe on February 13, 2015, 09:37:47 PM
Makes me wonder where the hell he has been - apart from Mustique. Kate is back to doing something and him? 

  He always been lazy (IMO)  I'm not surprised in the least that we have not seen him for weeks on end.

He has been on his second gap year since September or studying for his pilot gig as he calls it.

Quote from: Canuck on February 13, 2015, 08:59:06 PM
I'm sure he is, but given the optics of taking time off for vacation, I think making time for one or two engagements would be advisable at this point.

I agree. Hopefully one is scheduled before he departs to China.

As I explained, I'm making a complete list of all possible Royal engagements, and people can apply whatever criteria they like to reach their own count.  If, in counting engagements (rather than using days worked or some other metric), you get a similar number to the CC, that's your business -- though it would hardly be surprising, since the CC endeavors to list all the engagements the Royals do.

Do you really need to do all that Canuck?  I mean as logn as they're doing some work, why do you/people need to itemize every handshake etc?

I agree to a degree Amabel.  But as long as people want to see quantitative evidence of work, they will need to itemize the events.  The RF aren't using this in an official capacity, nor is the government.  It is only for royal watchers.

It is an on going discussion that will continue to be debated.  People want to compare the royals to one another so it is lovely of Canuck to do this.  And as she has said - each person can interpret the lists as they wish.

And it shows how pathetically little they all do. 

Quote from: Macrobug on February 14, 2015, 05:31:02 PM
I agree to a degree Amabel.  But as long as people want to see quantitative evidence of work, they will need to itemize the events.  The RF aren't using this in an official capacity, nor is the government.  It is only for royal watchers.

It

Its very nice of Canuck indeed, but I DO pay something towards the RF because I live here and really I'd rather pay for them than most of the things that the Govt waste their money on.

I don't think engagements are a complete or fully accurate way of judging Royal work, but because they're the public side of things they're the one people tend to use.  And as Macrobug says, we've had a LOT of discussion on this forum about engagement totals for those three, so as long as that's a thing people are interested in I think it's helpful to have an easily accessible list so everyone has accurate information to draw from.

I'm updating this a little before the end of the month because it looks likely that Kate and Harry are done for February and I wanted to get the non-Japan/China tour engagements on the list while they're fresh on my mind.  I'll do another update with Will's tour engagements once the trip is over.

One note:  I've removed the asterisk from Kate's Palliative Care Program reception because that's finally shown up on the online CC.  I've checked, but nothing additional has shown up for Will or Harry (and Will's investiture is not yet on there, though it was in the paper copy).  They really need to improve that website.


JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

Thanks again for doing this! :blowkiss:

Thank you Canuck. I agree it was a good idea to wrap up February, but should either Harry or Kate do something in the next few days it can always be added.  :)

Just goes to show just how lazy they all are.  Man alive...

Canuck-Another site is keeping track of how many engagements performed by the full/part-time working members in the BRF are being MISSED entirely. The British monarchy site is missing many of the BRF's events.

Quote from: Canuck on February 26, 2015, 04:31:19 PM

Kate

February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre

Wouldn't these count as one engagement each, since they are directly connected to each other?

I should think keeping tabs on the engagements for EVERY member of the BRF would be an absolute nightmare without a daily copy of The  Times. It's lucky that Kate, Harry and William do usually get photos and publicity and mentions online, even if William's investitures aren't photographed. Imagine tracking down the Gloucesters or the Duchess of Kent's or Princess Alexandra's engagements!

 @Lady Adams

Canuck is listing all events separately. She is leaving it up to each one of us as to how we want to count the appointments.  If you wish to count them as one then you are free to do so.  I am counting them separately as they were in  separate venues with different objectives and audience.  I am also adding PW ads and BAFTA video as a separate event due to the time required to plan and record.  But others don't and that is ok.

Canuck is giving us the objective quantitative data, interpretation is up to us. 

@Lady Adams I explained the February 12 engagements when I posted the mid-February tally.  The CC is listing them separately and when I looked at some maps it appears they although both in the general port area were completely different sites (Kate was driven between them) and there they were totally different sets of people at each (young student artists and construction workers vs. college students and community leaders).  As Macrobug says, people can count them differently if they like, but I found the CC's separate listing fair enough in the circumstances to use it here.

The February 18 engagements were totally separate:  different charities, different locations, no connection to one another other than that they were within driving distance.

@Canuck Thanks for your explanation. Since you are so active it's tough to remember everything you write.  :flower:

You may have your own view of which engagements should be counted, but I'd appreciate it if you didn't ascribe motives to me that aren't true.  I want an easily-consulted list for all of the inevitable debates about number and type of engagements.  That's all.

Quote from: Curryong on February 27, 2015, 12:12:51 AM
I should think keeping tabs on the engagements for EVERY member of the BRF would be an absolute nightmare without a daily copy of The  Times. It's lucky that Kate, Harry and William do usually get photos and publicity and mentions online, even if William's investitures aren't photographed. Imagine tracking down the Gloucesters or the Duchess of Kent's or Princess Alexandra's engagements!

:nod:I agree because if you didn't have access to the Times' CC list it would be impossible to record. The British Monarchy website is woefully inaccurate.

Quote from: snokitty on February 27, 2015, 12:03:45 PM
:lol:  You mean like the gang did to the thread that I started!   :orchid:

As I understood it, your thread was a list of which engagements you personally thought should be given credit.  In that case, there's obviously going to be debate about what value judgments you're making and why.

This is an attempt to provide as judgment-free a list as possible.  If you think there's an inaccuracy--something that was left off, or something that should be on it--then I'm absolutely interested in hearing about it because I'm doing my best to be accurate here.  But my own personal tally for each Royal, and why I count certain things or don't count certain others, isn't informing what I'm doing with this list.

Quote from: Canuck on February 14, 2015, 09:43:43 PM
I don't think engagements are a complete or fully accurate way of judging Royal work, but because they're the public side of things they're the one people tend to use.  And as Macrobug says, we've had a LOT of discussion on this forum about engagement totals for those three, so as long as that's a thing people are interested in I think it's helpful to have an easily accessible list so everyone has accurate information to draw from.

And thank you for providing us with this list where people can draw their own conclusions. :)

Below is an updated list that includes Will's engagements from Japan/China.  Nothing new for Harry or Kate.

I know someone will have this question, so I'll address it now:  yes, I've included the arrivals/departures because they appear in the CC.  People are free to not count them (or to only count those where the arrival included a component of meeting with a dignitary) when coming up with their own tallies.  Conversely, anyone who wants to do a count that follows the same guidelines used in the year-end totals the papers publish for all members of the BRF can include them.


JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: departed Heathrow for Japan
February 26: arrived in Japan/greeted by British ambassador
February 26: boat tour with Governor of Tokyo
February 26: tea ceremony in Hama-rikyu Gardens
February 27: lay wreath at Commonwealth cemetery
February 27: lunch with Emperor and Empress of Japan at Imperial Palace
February 27: meeting with Crown Prince and Crown Princess of Japan at Akasaka Palace
February 27: Innovation is Great launch in Tokyo
February 27: reception at British Embassy in Tokyo
February 28: visit to NHK Broadcasting Studio in Tokyo
February 28: visit to Innovation is Great display at T-Site Multimedia Store
February 28: visit to Smile Kids Park in Fukushima (with President of Japan)
February 28: dinner given by President of Japan

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

MARCH

Will
March 1: visit to Ishinomaki NewSea building
March 1: lay wreath at Hoyoriyama Hill Vantage Point
March 1: visit to Chime of Hope Market in Onagawa
March 1: visit Matsushima Airbase in Miyagi Prefecture
March 1: depart Tokyo and arrive Beijing/greeted by British ambassador
March 2: meeting with President of China
March 2: visit to Forbidden City
March 2: meeting with Vice President of China
March 2: opening of GREAT Festival of Creativity in Shanghai
March 2: received Founder/Executive Chairman of the Alibaba Group
March 2: received Chairman of Wanda Group
March 2: received Chairman of Sanpower
March 3: attended GREAT Festival of Creativity
March 3: Premier Skills event at Nanyang School
March 3: attend Education UK's Alumni Awards Ceremony
March 3: reopening of Heritage Building at Intercontinental Shanghai
March 3: International Wildlife Trafficking Meeting with NGOs
March 3: opened British Centre
March 3: Chinese premiere of the film Paddington
March 3: dinner for GREAT Festival
March 4: visit to Mengman Village, Xishuangbanna Dai Autonomous Prefecture
March 4: visit to Asian Elephant Sanctuary
March 4: visit to Wild Elephant Valley
March 4: visit to Xishuangbanna Tropical Botanical Gardens
March 4: attended Conservation on the Border Conference
March 4: departed Hong Kong for Britain
March 5: arrived at Heathrow

Kate
None

Harry
None

As I've explained, I'm including anything in the CC and also including anything that seems to be Royal work but that wasn't in the CC (those items have asterisks next to them, like Harry signing the condolence book). 

If there are specific things missing for Harry, I would love your help in pointing me to them.  I'm trying to include any Royal work that takes place, though when it's unofficial (not on the CC) it can be hard to find it and to sort out what was Royal vs. not.

If anyone does realize that something is missing for any of the royals listed here please let Canuck know as she compiles the list.  :)

Thank you for the update on the Duke's tour of Japan and China Canuck.

If anyone reads of a visit by either of them that isn't covered in the CC then I do believe it is worth sharing. She'll add an asterisk.  :)

Quote from: snokitty on March 05, 2015, 08:45:25 PM
Since she is copying the CC does it really matter?

The CC is a list of engagements, including K, W and H
This is a list of engagements of K, W and H.

Unless you are hoping that Canuck creates a work of fiction and invents engagements (or not list engagements that happened) there is a very good chance that there will be some similarities between the two.  They may even be the same. 

  :shrug:

Quote from: TLLK on March 05, 2015, 08:43:59 PM
If anyone does realize that something is missing for any of the royals listed here please let Canuck know as she compiles the list.  :)

Thank you for the update on the Duke's tour of Japan and China Canuck.

Yes, thank you very much for your updates on this tour, Canuck. It's a pity the British press didn't follow it more.

Happy to help!  I personally find the CC website extremely cumbersome (and riddled with small inaccuracies the print copy does not suffer from), so hopefully this serves as a helpful tool for anyone who would like to see at a glance all of the engagements deemed "official" by the BRF as well as any other "non-official" Royal work (marked by asterisks) that for whatever reason was not included in the CC.

Quote from: Macrobug on March 05, 2015, 10:43:30 PM

Quote from: snokitty on March 05, 2015, 08:45:25 PM
Since she is copying the CC does it really matter?

The CC is a list of engagements, including K, W and H
This is a list of engagements of K, W and H.

Unless you are hoping that Canuck creates a work of fiction and invents engagements (or not list engagements that happened) there is a very good chance that there will be some similarities between the two.  They may even be the same. 

  :shrug:

I'm demanding that my fictional account of the tea party held with Harry, Estelle and Lenore be counted in the tally. Adding an asterisk will be acceptable to me, but I'm not sure about the youngest Swedish princesses.  :D

Quote from: Canuck on March 06, 2015, 12:11:07 AM
Happy to help!  I personally find the CC website extremely cumbersome (and riddled with small inaccuracies the print copy does not suffer from), so hopefully this serves as a helpful tool for anyone who would like to see at a glance all of the engagements deemed "official" by the BRF as well as any other "non-official" Royal work (marked by asterisks) that for whatever reason was not included in the CC.

It is surprising that the print copy that is in the Times is more accurate than the website. Why the issues in supplying the same information? :unsure:

Quote from: snokitty on March 06, 2015, 05:24:38 AM
The point is if she is just copying the CC the padding will just be repeated. Getting on and off airplanes is not considered working by any standards unless one is trying to pad the numbers.

People are certainly welcome to simply not include arrivals/departures in their own count.  But as for when those are considered "work" -- they're included in the CC for every single Royal.  So if someone wants a tally to compare W/K/H to the totals of other members of the BRF, they will want to include those things so as to apply the same rules to everyone.  If by contrast someone wants a tally of what they personally believe to be meaningful engagements, then perhaps they wouldn't include them or would include only those that involve meeting with a dignitary at the airport.

Quote from: Canuck on March 06, 2015, 06:17:18 AM

Quote from: snokitty on March 06, 2015, 05:24:38 AM
The point is if she is just copying the CC the padding will just be repeated. Getting on and off airplanes is not considered working by any standards unless one is trying to pad the numbers.

People are certainly welcome to simply not include arrivals/departures in their own count.  But as for when those are considered "work" -- they're included in the CC for every single Royal.  So if someone wants a tally to compare W/K/H to the totals of other members of the BRF, they will want to include those things so as to apply the same rules to everyone.  If by contrast someone wants a tally of what they personally believe to be meaningful engagements, then perhaps they wouldn't include them or would include only those that involve meeting with a dignitary at the airport.

Personally I wouldn't count their own departures/arrivals at an airport though I know the CC does do it. However when a member of the BRF or any other royal family meet a visiting HoS or dignitary at the airport then I would consider it an engagement.

---

Double post auto-merged: March 07, 2015, 03:29:10 PM

---

Apparently the British Monarchy site has responded to the numerous complaints about missing engagements and have been routinely updating the site.

Church services are going to be prominent this week with the Commonwealth and Afghanistan events.

No just simply pointing out that there are services for the Commonwealth and Afghanistan this week. :)

It's Good to be Queen : Photo (http://theroyalfirm.tumblr.com/image/113170514439)

Kate and William are there but no Harry. I dont think he will be showing up.

Quote from: snokitty on March 09, 2015, 02:23:40 PM
PA Royal Reporters ‏@PARoyal

Quote#Kate's last official engagement was on Feb 18 at @EmmaBridgewater for @EACH_hospices #growingbump

From Canuck's count

QuoteFebruary 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

:hmm:  looks like some padding going on.

The engagements on the 24th and the 25th were not open to the press, so that's probably why the reporter tweeting that message didn't mention them/didn't remember them.

Quote from: tiaras on March 09, 2015, 03:59:52 PM
It's Good to be Queen : Photo (http://theroyalfirm.tumblr.com/image/113170514439)

Kate and William are there but no Harry. I dont think he will be showing up.

I don't believe he was to be at this one today, but will be there for the Afghanistan service.  :)

Odd.. that tweet doesn't seem to be there anymore. Perhaps @PARoyal realized their mistake.

^^^It's likely that @PARoyal did and then removed it because her last engagement was on Feb. 25th before William left for Japan.

Quote from: TLLK on March 09, 2015, 07:22:59 PM

Quote from: tiaras on March 09, 2015, 03:59:52 PM
It's Good to be Queen : Photo (http://theroyalfirm.tumblr.com/image/113170514439)

Kate and William are there but no Harry. I dont think he will be showing up.

I don't believe he was to be at this one today, but will be there for the Afghanistan service.  :)

I doubt he will be present for that either. 


"Prince Harry's been on a private trip to Lesotho the past few days. He's expected to be more hands-on w/#Sentebale when he leaves the army."
HWalesWire

Never fear tiaras!! There is reason for red eye flights!! He might be slightly rumpled but I do believe that he's going to be there.

I would be very surprised if Harry missed the Afghanistan service.  He did actually serve there, and pretty much the entire family is coming out for the service.

Interesting he's back in Lesotho -- I wonder where the HWalesWire twitter found out, as none of the Royal reporters seem to have anything on it.

Quote from: TLLK on March 10, 2015, 02:20:39 AM
Never fear tiaras!! There is reason for red eye flights!! He might be slightly rumpled but I do believe that he's going to be there.

That reminds me, does anyone know if Kate is pencilled in, with William,  to present the shamrock to the Irish Guards this St Patrick's Day?

It was just announced this morning that they would be presenting on the 17th, yes, @Curryong

Quote from: Adrienne on March 10, 2015, 11:49:05 AM
It was just announced this morning that they would be presenting on the 17th, yes, @Curryong

Thankyou Adrienne. The Guards have such a cute Irish Wolfhound mascot.

Quote from: Curryong on March 10, 2015, 11:53:04 AM

Quote from: Adrienne on March 10, 2015, 11:49:05 AM
It was just announced this morning that they would be presenting on the 17th, yes, @Curryong

Thankyou Adrienne. The Guards have such a cute Irish Wolfhound mascot.

He is cute especially with his cape and shamrocks.

---

Double post auto-merged: March 10, 2015, 05:39:45 PM

---

Quote from: Canuck on March 10, 2015, 02:33:26 AM
I would be very surprised if Harry missed the Afghanistan service.  He did actually serve there, and pretty much the entire family is coming out for the service.

Interesting he's back in Lesotho -- I wonder where the HWalesWire twitter found out, as none of the Royal reporters seem to have anything on it.

I truly believe that he will be present for the Afghanistan service as he is the BRF's veteran for that campaign. Hope that he's in the uniform worn for his balcony appearances.

Irish Wolfhounds are NOT cute - they are noble, loyal and magnificent but never cute.

Odd no confirm on Harry being in Lesotho - but yes I feel confident he'll show for the Afghanistan service

Do you have an Irish wolfhound as a part of your family, Cate?

LOL - how did you guess Curryong?  Wolfhounds are truly wonderful affectionate loyal beasts - do recall the origin of their name, they were once used to hunt wolves.  And were for many centuries the favored hounds of Kings (Richard III was said to have favored wolfhounds).  So "cute" really just is not the dignified word to use - or so I must say in defense of their dignity.  Tongue in cheek of course.

We have had three - wonderful companions - but they will break your heart - they do not live very long.  I miss both of our previous hounds and enjoy our current fellow while we can.  Loyal and gentle they are wonderful dogs. 

They look as if they'd be very affectionate pets and are magnificent-looking animals. Why aren't they long-lived?

^^^I've read that very large breeds like Great Danes and Irish Wolfhounds have short life spans due to their size.

Time for the mid-month update.  New March events are below.

JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: departed Heathrow for Japan
February 26: arrived in Japan/greeted by British ambassador
February 26: boat tour with Governor of Tokyo
February 26: tea ceremony in Hama-rikyu Gardens
February 27: lay wreath at Commonwealth cemetery
February 27: lunch with Emperor and Empress of Japan at Imperial Palace
February 27: meeting with Crown Prince and Crown Princess of Japan at Akasaka Palace
February 27: Innovation is Great launch in Tokyo
February 27: reception at British Embassy in Tokyo
February 28: visit to NHK Broadcasting Studio in Tokyo
February 28: visit to Innovation is Great display at T-Site Multimedia Store
February 28: visit to Smile Kids Park in Fukushima (with President of Japan)
February 28: dinner given by President of Japan

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

MARCH

Will
March 1: visit to Ishinomaki NewSea building
March 1: lay wreath at Hoyoriyama Hill Vantage Point
March 1: visit to Chime of Hope Market in Onagawa
March 1: visit Matsushima Airbase in Miyagi Prefecture
March 1: depart Tokyo and arrive Beijing/greeted by British ambassador
March 2: meeting with President of China
March 2: visit to Forbidden City
March 2: meeting with Vice President of China
March 2: opening of GREAT Festival of Creativity in Shanghai
March 2: received Founder/Executive Chairman of the Alibaba Group
March 2: received Chairman of Wanda Group
March 2: received Chairman of Sanpower
March 3: attended GREAT Festival of Creativity
March 3: Premier Skills event at Nanyang School
March 3: attend Education UK's Alumni Awards Ceremony
March 3: reopening of Heritage Building at Intercontinental Shanghai
March 3: International Wildlife Trafficking Meeting with NGOs
March 3: opened British Centre
March 3: Chinese premiere of the film Paddington
March 3: dinner for GREAT Festival
March 4: visit to Mengman Village, Xishuangbanna Dai Autonomous Prefecture
March 4: visit to Asian Elephant Sanctuary
March 4: visit to Wild Elephant Valley
March 4: visit to Xishuangbanna Tropical Botanical Gardens
March 4: attended Conservation on the Border Conference
March 4: departed Hong Kong for Britain
March 5: arrived at Heathrow
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's

Kate
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 11: visit to Turner Contemporary gallery
March 11: visit to Resort Studios in Margate
March 12: visit to set of Downton Abbey/Ealing Studios
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's

Harry
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's

^^^Thank you Canuck for keeping this thread updated. :thumbsup:

Thanks from me, too, Canuck.  That's quite a list!  :)

Cindy

Quote from: cinrit on March 13, 2015, 11:04:01 PM
Thanks from me, too, Canuck.  That's quite a list!  :)

Cindy

And from me too, Canuck. What a lot of work! :thumbsup:

No problem, all!  Except for Will's trip it's never all that much work -- updating every few weeks make it easy.

So, Kate has worked 13 "days" and vacationed 15, two more days of work and she will have broken even! Go Kate!  :hehe:

I don't think there's anything scheduled for tomorrow, so here's an update as of the end of March.  Also, from earlier in the month, I added the receptions Will and Harry went to after the Afghanistan service.

JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: departed Heathrow for Japan
February 26: arrived in Japan/greeted by British ambassador
February 26: boat tour with Governor of Tokyo
February 26: tea ceremony in Hama-rikyu Gardens
February 27: lay wreath at Commonwealth cemetery
February 27: lunch with Emperor and Empress of Japan at Imperial Palace
February 27: meeting with Crown Prince and Crown Princess of Japan at Akasaka Palace
February 27: Innovation is Great launch in Tokyo
February 27: reception at British Embassy in Tokyo
February 28: visit to NHK Broadcasting Studio in Tokyo
February 28: visit to Innovation is Great display at T-Site Multimedia Store
February 28: visit to Smile Kids Park in Fukushima (with President of Japan)
February 28: dinner given by President of Japan

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

MARCH

Will
March 1: visit to Ishinomaki NewSea building
March 1: lay wreath at Hoyoriyama Hill Vantage Point
March 1: visit to Chime of Hope Market in Onagawa
March 1: visit Matsushima Airbase in Miyagi Prefecture
March 1: depart Tokyo and arrive Beijing/greeted by British ambassador
March 2: meeting with President of China
March 2: visit to Forbidden City
March 2: meeting with Vice President of China
March 2: opening of GREAT Festival of Creativity in Shanghai
March 2: received Founder/Executive Chairman of the Alibaba Group
March 2: received Chairman of Wanda Group
March 2: received Chairman of Sanpower
March 3: attended GREAT Festival of Creativity
March 3: Premier Skills event at Nanyang School
March 3: attend Education UK's Alumni Awards Ceremony
March 3: reopening of Heritage Building at Intercontinental Shanghai
March 3: International Wildlife Trafficking Meeting with NGOs
March 3: opened British Centre
March 3: Chinese premiere of the film Paddington
March 3: dinner for GREAT Festival
March 4: visit to Mengman Village, Xishuangbanna Dai Autonomous Prefecture
March 4: visit to Asian Elephant Sanctuary
March 4: visit to Wild Elephant Valley
March 4: visit to Xishuangbanna Tropical Botanical Gardens
March 4: attended Conservation on the Border Conference
March 4: departed Hong Kong for Britain
March 5: arrived at Heathrow
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Horse Guards Parade
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
*March 18: attend meetings with ambassadors with the Queen
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate
March 27: meeting of the Royal Foundation

Kate
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 11: visit to Turner Contemporary gallery
March 11: visit to Resort Studios in Margate
March 12: visit to set of Downton Abbey/Ealing Studios
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
March 18: visit to Home-Start at Brookhill Children's Centre
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate

Harry
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Guildhall
March 18: reception for Walking for the Wounded
March 21: rugby match between England and France

Thank you for the March round up Canuck.

Thanks Canuck  :flower:

I think you missed PW attending the receptions of the ambassadors with QE.

Thanks for the reminder, Macrobug!  I've added that to Will's list (with an asterisk, since it's not listed in the CC).

Thanks, Canuck. :flower: 

SC, do you mean the engagements are close together?  Why does that matter?

Cindy

^^ Thanks for the explanation, SC.

Cindy

Doing multiple engagements in one day does have some advantages.  For one thing, it can save money (especially when some travel is required, e.g. Kate doing two engagements in Margate in one day, rather than traveling out there on two separate occasions).

^^^I agree Canuck. Some of the kingdoms are quite small ie: Belgium, Denmark, Netherlands so it is easier for their royals to visit various provinces/cities. Spain, the UK, etc...have longer distances to consider when they're visiting.

Time for an end-of-the-month update.

A note on Harry:  the online CC hasn't been updated yet with Canberra info, so we don't have a definite count of exactly how many discrete engagements they're counting.  But all of the press information KP released said it was one engagement (visiting the Australian War Memorial), with the rest (like having his picture taken as he reports for duty) presumably being military rather than Royal work.  I've counted it as one engagement in accordance with KP's press releases; if the CC later shows something different, I'll update accordingly.

JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: departed Heathrow for Japan
February 26: arrived in Japan/greeted by British ambassador
February 26: boat tour with Governor of Tokyo
February 26: tea ceremony in Hama-rikyu Gardens
February 27: lay wreath at Commonwealth cemetery
February 27: lunch with Emperor and Empress of Japan at Imperial Palace
February 27: meeting with Crown Prince and Crown Princess of Japan at Akasaka Palace
February 27: Innovation is Great launch in Tokyo
February 27: reception at British Embassy in Tokyo
February 28: visit to NHK Broadcasting Studio in Tokyo
February 28: visit to Innovation is Great display at T-Site Multimedia Store
February 28: visit to Smile Kids Park in Fukushima (with President of Japan)
February 28: dinner given by President of Japan

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

MARCH

Will
March 1: visit to Ishinomaki NewSea building
March 1: lay wreath at Hoyoriyama Hill Vantage Point
March 1: visit to Chime of Hope Market in Onagawa
March 1: visit Matsushima Airbase in Miyagi Prefecture
March 1: depart Tokyo and arrive Beijing/greeted by British ambassador
March 2: meeting with President of China
March 2: visit to Forbidden City
March 2: meeting with Vice President of China
March 2: opening of GREAT Festival of Creativity in Shanghai
March 2: received Founder/Executive Chairman of the Alibaba Group
March 2: received Chairman of Wanda Group
March 2: received Chairman of Sanpower
March 3: attended GREAT Festival of Creativity
March 3: Premier Skills event at Nanyang School
March 3: attend Education UK's Alumni Awards Ceremony
March 3: reopening of Heritage Building at Intercontinental Shanghai
March 3: International Wildlife Trafficking Meeting with NGOs
March 3: opened British Centre
March 3: Chinese premiere of the film Paddington
March 3: dinner for GREAT Festival
March 4: visit to Mengman Village, Xishuangbanna Dai Autonomous Prefecture
March 4: visit to Asian Elephant Sanctuary
March 4: visit to Wild Elephant Valley
March 4: visit to Xishuangbanna Tropical Botanical Gardens
March 4: attended Conservation on the Border Conference
March 4: departed Hong Kong for Britain
March 5: arrived at Heathrow
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Horse Guards Parade
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
*March 18: attend meetings with ambassadors with the Queen
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate
March 27: meeting of the Royal Foundation

Kate
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 11: visit to Turner Contemporary gallery
March 11: visit to Resort Studios in Margate
March 12: visit to set of Downton Abbey/Ealing Studios
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
March 18: visit to Home-Start at Brookhill Children's Centre
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate

Harry
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Guildhall
March 18: reception for Walking for the Wounded
March 21: rugby match between England and France

APRIL

Will
April 25: Gallipoli wreath laying ceremony

Kate
None

Harry
April 6: visit to Australian War Memorial
April 22: arrived in Istanbul
April 24: reception on HMS Bulwark
April 24: attended international service at Abide
April 24: attended Commonwealth and Ireland service at Helles
April 24: attended French service at Morto Bay
April 25: attended dawn service at ANZAC Cove
April 25: attended breakfast reception
April 25: attended Australian service at Lone Pine
April 25: attended Service of Thanksgiving at the 57th Regiment Memorial
April 25: attended New Zealand service at Chunuk Bair
April 25: arrived in UK from Turkey
April 26: presented prizes at London marathon

Thank you very much for collating all that, Canuck. Good grief, William certainly excelled himself in March, but then went back to his usual numbers in April. Interesting too, that Kate had ten engagements in March, cramming them in before going into retirement in April.

I think that's because of the other things they were doing.  Will seems to have spent the bulk of April getting through his helicopter training so it would be done before the baby came.  Kate, obviously, started her maternity leave at the beginning of the month, in line with how BRF maternity leaves generally go (stopping engagements a few weeks before the due date). 

Harry is actually in the same boat -- he did a bunch of engagements in April, but all but two came in that two-day period he was in Turkey for the commemorations.  Otherwise, he's been tied up with his military work. 

 :goodpost: Great wrap-up @Canuck

Quote from: Canuck on April 30, 2015, 03:01:27 PM
I think that's because of the other things they were doing.  Will seems to have spent the bulk of April getting through his helicopter training so it would be done before the baby came.  Kate, obviously, started her maternity leave at the beginning of the month, in line with how BRF maternity leaves generally go (stopping engagements a few weeks before the due date). 

Harry is actually in the same boat -- he did a bunch of engagements in April, but all but two came in that two-day period he was in Turkey for the commemorations.  Otherwise, he's been tied up with his military work. 

Great summary of the April events and in the months before @Canuck.

As I've said repeatedly, everyone is free to come to their own conclusions about what things constitute "work".  But I'm making a list of engagements, and the BRF has always included arrivals and departures from foreign travel in its reporting of engagements. 

Quote from: Canuck on April 30, 2015, 07:47:29 PM
As I've said repeatedly, everyone is free to come to their own conclusions about what things constitute "work".  But I'm making a list of engagements, and the BRF has always included arrivals and departures from foreign travel in its reporting of engagements. 

And I predict that you'll repeat this again for May, June, July...etc... :P

I have to agree, how can "departed Heathrow for Japan" be an engagement for William? That is embarassingly absurd of Kap and the BRF.

And, for Kate, how can "going to Ben Kingsley racing office" and "going to Ben Kingsley Headquarters" be two separate engagements???  :orchid:

Good points, @Limabeany.

Quote from: Limabeany on May 01, 2015, 01:52:50 AM
I have to agree, how can "departed Heathrow for Japan" be an engagement for William? That is embarassingly absurd of Kap and the BRF.

For the same reason arriving in Istanbul is an engagement for Harry:  the BRF has always listed international arrivals and departures in the CC.  Which isn't intended to be a definitive list of "this is all of the work done by members of the Royal family", though because of engagement tallies being popular in the press there's a tendency to report it that way. 

QuoteAnd, for Kate, how can "going to Ben Kingsley racing office" and "going to Ben Kingsley Headquarters" be two separate engagements???  :orchid:

I explained that back when those engagements were first posted.  Those are two separate locations in two different cities -- one is the current base of operations where Kate visited to see the racing technology and press were not allowed because they didn't want their racing secrets to be given away.  The second was the visit to the construction site for the new headquarters, where Kate met with student artists working on the mural as well as some of the construction workers.

I agree with @snokitty but this is how the system's run. So, the problem is not specifically William and Kate it is with the system. The Monarchy as a whole in contemporary times raises a lot of questions, but as long as there are no complains and protests to overthrow them, they will remain and continue.

Also @Canuck was just explaining and answering your Questions.

Quote from: Canuck on May 01, 2015, 03:24:02 AM

Quote from: Limabeany on May 01, 2015, 01:52:50 AM
I have to agree, how can "departed Heathrow for Japan" be an engagement for William? That is embarassingly absurd of Kap and the BRF.

For the same reason arriving in Istanbul is an engagement for Harry:  the BRF has always listed international arrivals and departures in the CC.  Which isn't intended to be a definitive list of "this is all of the work done by members of the Royal family", though because of engagement tallies being popular in the press there's a tendency to report it that way. 

QuoteAnd, for Kate, how can "going to Ben Kingsley racing office" and "going to Ben Kingsley Headquarters" be two separate engagements???  :orchid:

I explained that back when those engagements were first posted.  Those are two separate locations in two different cities -- one is the current base of operations where Kate visited to see the racing technology and press were not allowed because they didn't want their racing secrets to be given away.  The second was the visit to the construction site for the new headquarters, where Kate met with student artists working on the mural as well as some of the construction workers.

I disagree @Canuck  and I wasn't talking about Harry, but about two specific incidents, I don't see why you used Harry because I did not mention Harry or William's arrivals, surely you can defend William on his own merits without using Harry, Harry's departure from Heathrow is not an engagement, why should it be for William!? Departing Heathrow is hardly reasonable to call an engagement unless Cameron went to say goodbye personally. And, I didn't question William's arrival, why didn't younuse that to defend William instead of Harry who was not mentioned. 

As for Kate... It was part of the same engagement on the same day in Portsmouth. Not traveling to different cities or even different charities. What next? Departing KP will be an engagement for William and going from room to room separate engagements for Kate?

http://www.ybw.com/pictures/kate-middleton-visits-ben-ainslie-racing-portsmouth-9893

I'm not telling you what to do.  If you want to not count any or all of the engagements listed, by all means go ahead.  But when someone says that theres an error in the list (like two engagements actually being the same thing, for example), I'm obviously going to respond and explain why those things are listed as they are. 

@Limabeany, the first Ben Ainslie office visit was not in Portsmouth.  It was at the old office in Whiteley, 11 miles from Portsmouth.  Press were not allowed at that part, but Ben Ainslie talked about it in articles so it's confirmed that it happened.

As for airplane arrivals and departures, I mentioned Harry because he's the only one who had one of those added this month.  But the same applies to Will, Kate, and every other member of the BRF:  when arriving or departing on international trips, the CC lists those things.  That means the engagement totals published at the end of the year--for everyone--include those things.  I agree they're not separate work, but if you want an apples-to-apples comparison with people like Charles, Anne, Sophie, or even Diana's old tallies, then you'll want to include those things in your tally from the younger Royals.  If you want a number that just includes what you think is real work, then you may not want to include them (or include only the ones where the arrival/departure included meeting with a dignitary).  But either way, I'm going to keep listing them.

Or perhaps people don't agree as to a single "point" in keeping track of engagements, which is why I started a thread of my own.

Yes, someone could look at the CC.  But it's a very badly designed website, and searching through for each of the younger Royals and tallying up separate engagements (as well as identifying those that never made it onto the online CC, which happens semi-regularly) is time-consuming and annoying.  I wanted to keep a running list somewhere that would let people see at a glance every engagement for all three of W/K/H, as a more convenient reference.  If you don't find it helpful, then by all means don't use it.  I do find it helpful, and hopefully some of the other members of this forum do as well.

Quote from: Canuck on May 01, 2015, 12:24:58 PM
Or perhaps people don't agree as to a single "point" in keeping track of engagements, which is why I started a thread of my own.

Yes, someone could look at the CC.  But it's a very badly designed website, and searching through for each of the younger Royals and tallying up separate engagements (as well as identifying those that never made it onto the online CC, which happens semi-regularly) is time-consuming and annoying.  I wanted to keep a running list somewhere that would let people see at a glance every engagement for all three of W/K/H, as a more convenient reference.  If you don't find it helpful, then by all means don't use it.  I do find it helpful, and hopefully some of the other members of this forum do as well.

I find it useful and I appreciate the time that you take to summarize the trio's engagements. I know you're not assigning a total number to the engagement list, but if a poster chooses to do so then that's an option they can utilize.

Canuck has explained at length throughout the thread where her information is to be found. She is correct that the British monarchy website is known for not keeping an accurate account of engagements performed for all members of the BRF. The London Times Court Circular publishes the information provided which for decades has included overseas/return trip arrivals/departures by ship or aircraft. If she's using the CC as a source expect those events to be included until the BRF chooses to end the practice. As @tiaras pointed out it is the system that is in control of determining what is an engagement or not.

Perhaps it would be more productive to contact the Court Circular and request that they not include arrivals/departures when listing engagements for HM/DoE etc....

Quote from: snokitty on May 01, 2015, 02:26:50 PM
Just my own personal conclusion if that is alright with you. Or is it that only certain conclusions are acceptable.   :hmm:  Must be since I have stated over and over that is my conclusion and some posters continue to argue their conclusion as being the right one.

One should ask themselves why?

I think you'll find that just as you have every right to state your opinions, other posters have every right to disagree with them.  If you want to state over and over that you don't think this list is helpful, that's perfectly fine; but expect other posters to respond with their own opinions on the same.

Quote from: tiaras on May 01, 2015, 07:15:52 AM
I agree with @snokitty but this is how the system's run. So, the problem is not specifically William and Kate it is with the system. The Monarchy as a whole in contemporary times raises a lot of questions, but as long as there are no complains and protests to overthrow them, they will remain and continue.

Also @Canuck was just explaining and answering your Questions.

Thank you @tiaras for pointing out that the issues people might have lie not with specific members but the system. The method of how, when, why the CC lists engagements for the BRF were established decades ago. Many of the members were not even alive when George V had a single system devised to list the family's engagements. It appears that QEII is content with the method that has been published throughout her long reign.

Also thank you again for reminding everyone that @Canuck has taken the time to answer questions. @Canuck's explanation that she is using the CC as her source of information and providing an * to known engagements that were not listed in the CC ie: Harry signing the condolence book at the French embassy to try and provide the best coverage of their engagements is listed in her initial post.

---

Double post auto-merged: May 01, 2015, 03:26:13 PM

---

OOPs that should be George III and not George V who established the Court Circular.

I know we all like to disagree and debate on other parts of the board, but I have tried very hard in this one thread to provide as even-handed and accurate a list of engagements as possible.  I've given a complete list of CC engagements, and I've included (with asterisks to distinguish them) anything that looked like Royal work but wasn't on the CC.  I've explained--in detail--why things have been listed as they are.  I've answered any questions people had as to why things were here/not or were listed a certain way.

My goal here is just to provide a list that people can use (if they like, obviously no one is required to) in reaching their own conclusions as to how much and what type of work the younger Royals have done.  I am really, sincerely not trying to slant the tallies or convince people to count certain engagements or to agree with any particular view other than "this is a hopefully comprehensive list of the possible universe of Royal work, if you'd like it can be used as any easy reference point to count up (based on any criteria you like) what Royal work was done."

Obviously everyone is entitled to post their own opinions, up to and including laughing at and criticizing me for making this list.  But for the sake of keeping things relatively pleasant around here, could we perhaps reach some kind of truce on this issue? 

You'll notice, @snokitty, that I haven't posted on your own engagement thread since two days after you started it when (at the suggestion of @Lady Adams, among others) I started this thread to provide my own list of engagements.  That's not because I don't have disagreements with how you're counting things, it's because I decided that I would simply keep my own running list rather than argue with you about your methodology.  Perhaps you could agree to extend the same courtesy.

I'm sure everyone will have lots to discuss and debate regarding engagement tallies at the end of the year.  And if there are specific questions as to why something has been listed here in a particular way, or someone notices something was left off, I have been and continue to be happy to explain or to make corrections. 

But it's incredibly disheartening to spend time doing my very best to create an accurate and unbiased list (dealing with the CC/filling holes in the online CC via mentions of the paper CC on twitter/researching engagement locations/keeping track of non-CC appearances, and to sometimes spend quite a bit of time trying to sort out whether certain things were Royal vs. other appearances or whether the CC was right to list two things together vs. separately, and to explain in detail why certain things have been listed in certain ways) only to then have the exact same fight about arrivals/departures or be laughed at for "padding" numbers.

@Canuck do you know if the CC ever credited Harry for his trip to the Australian War Memorial? It's been a topic of discussion at another site that it had not been listed.

I appreciate that you are including events documented by photo, video etc...that are not always listed in the CC. I know that you do apply an asterisk to some that are not formally acknowledged but at least it is being included in your summary.

 :hug: @TLLK

Canuck, I for one appreciate all the work you do for this, because the CC website really isn't user friendly.

It's also pretty obvious to me that you have no "tally" or "numbers" in the posts you make, so accusations that you're "padding the numbers" etc are bizarre to me and I can only conclude that they're a way to create a false equivalency and drag this thread down (in much the same way that some people like to continue to push an opinion again and again and then accuse others of never shutting up when it's responded to) .   :shrug: 

Quote from: TLLK on May 01, 2015, 04:25:40 PM
@Canuck do you know if the CC ever credited Harry for his trip to the Australian War Memorial? It's been a topic of discussion at another site that it had not been listed.

It's not on the online CC yet, though that doesn't mean anything (it often misses engagements that only appear weeks or months later).  But KP announced in advance that the War Memorial would be Harry's one engagement in Australia, so they definitely consider that as an engagement even if the CC hasn't caught it yet.

And thanks, @Adrienne.   :hug:

Thank you @Canuck. I hope that the CC catches up with this and credits him soon.

And just to be perfectly clear once again:  this list is intended to be overinclusive.  I'm trying to list everything that anyone might consider Royal work (not things that I personally believe deserve credit as Royal work). 

That way, anyone who wants to use it as a reference can just go down the list and count each thing they think should be given credit, without having to go research what other things the trio did during the year that weren't on the list because Canuck personally didn't think they should be given credit for them.

@Macrobug-You bring up a good point in that the CC has been and continues to be a means of communications about the activities of the BRF. The "numbers tally" didn't even begin until the late 1970's with Mr. O'Donovan writing to the Times at the end of the year with his own personal tally.

---

Double post auto-merged: May 01, 2015, 05:33:46 PM

---

Quote from: Limabeany on May 01, 2015, 01:52:50 AM
I have to agree, how can "departed Heathrow for Japan" be an engagement for William? That is embarassingly absurd of Kap and the BRF.

And, for Kate, how can "going to Ben Kingsley racing office" and "going to Ben Kingsley Headquarters" be two separate engagements???  :orchid:

@Limabeany-if you look at page two on this thread you can find @Canuck's original answer to @Lady Adams question about the engagement. :)

Quote from: snokitty on May 01, 2015, 06:04:21 PM
I see differences in the numbers you have and actual engagements done. Therefore my conclusion is that the count is being padded.

What "numbers"?  What "count"? 

I don't know how I can be clearer about this:  I'm not saying all of the things listed should be "counted" as real work.  I'm not posting a tally, I'm not drawing conclusions about what counts and doesn't.  All I'm doing is listing everything in the CC as well as (marked with asterisks, so it's clear) things that seems to be Royal work but that didn't appear in the CC. 

If you see something I included that wasn't in the CC, please let me know.  If you see something I missed, please let me know.  If you just disagree that some of the things the CC lists should be credited as work, I'm not going to be able to do anything about that.

Quote from: Canuck on May 01, 2015, 04:49:56 PM
And just to be perfectly clear once again:  this list is intended to be overinclusive.  I'm trying to list everything that anyone might consider Royal work (not things that I personally believe deserve credit as Royal work). 

That way, anyone who wants to use it as a reference can just go down the list and count each thing they think should be given credit, without having to go research what other things the trio did during the year that weren't on the list because Canuck personally didn't think they should be given credit for them.

It's not easy keeping track of this type of information because the CC and BRF websites are not known for their accuracy so thank you for keeping an watch on the articles, videos, etc...that show the trio out and about on their activities.

Quote from: Canuck on May 01, 2015, 06:11:10 PM

Quote from: snokitty on May 01, 2015, 06:04:21 PM
I see differences in the numbers you have and actual engagements done. Therefore my conclusion is that the count is being padded.

What "numbers"?  What "count"? 

I don't know how I can be clearer about this:  I'm not saying all of the things listed should be "counted" as real work.  I'm not posting a tally, I'm not drawing conclusions about what counts and doesn't.  All I'm doing is listing everything in the CC as well as (marked with asterisks, so it's clear) things that seems to be Royal work but that didn't appear in the CC. 

If you see something I included that wasn't in the CC, please let me know.  If you see something I missed, please let me know.  If you just disagree that some of the things the CC lists should be credited as work, I'm not going to be able to do anything about that.

You know @Canuck considering that the BRF has joined the 21st century with their various accounts I have to wonder why they cannot keep the CC website more accurately updated?  :shrug:

That's a great question.  And it's not just the inaccuracy/slowness to update, it's also how clunky and non-user friendly the site is.  The BRF has really embraced internet communication over the past few years -- better websites, twitter, instagram, etc.  I hope someone takes a good look at the CC website at some point and brings it into the 21st century.

I have this image of the CC secretary working in a dusty room filled with back copies of the Times, a typewriter, and sending everything by pony and trap to the Times.  :P

I have a feeling this will be a very quiet May for the trio and that we won't see too many engagements being performed until June.

Quote from: TLLK on May 04, 2015, 05:27:39 PM
I have a feeling this will be a very quiet May for the trio and that we won't see too many engagements being performed until June.

well Kat is hardly Mrs Busy even when she's not aching all over and exhausted after giving brith..

^^Checked the always reliable-NOT <_< website for the British Monarchy for future engagements for William and Harry. Of course they have nothing listed for either.
Harry's engagements in May for Australia-"no results found" (He's starting a tour to NZ!!!)
Harry's engagements in NZ-"no results found"

For June's Garter Ceremony and Trooping the Color which typically features both brothers-"no results found."

Their website is poorly managed. No wonder so many members of the family have had engagements not even recorded by the website that were documented by the press.

I believe that the poster on TRF who does the weekly update includes a record now of 'missing days' from the online CC compared to the print CC and there are now only two days missing - both from last week.

That poster had a list of dates for a number of weeks and progressively the online CC did update all dates -- coincidence or the result of the information out there who knows but having a poster somewhere in the internet calling them out weekly can't have hurt.

I know that the rule here is that you can't copy the posts but has anyone thought to ask that poster if they would object to having the information carried across here??

That poster keeps the figures for all the members of the BRF not only William, Kate and Harry.

This thread - yes but the entire forum is only interested in William, Kate and Harry - how sad for a site that calls itself 'Royal Insight' that it has deteriorated in the 18 or so months that I couldn't access the site (new modem opened it up again while previous modem would scramble the site - only site it did that to mind you) to being only dedicated to three people. If the entire forum is only interested in those three people then surely it should be renamed from 'royal' insight to 'William, Kate and Harry insight'.

But memememe, we discuss many members of the royal family on RI.

It was just that there was discussion a few months about the Cambridges' engagements and how they stacked up over a year, also Harry's. Because the online site dealing with royal engagements isn't particularly reliable and the CC is only printed in a few newspapers it's much easier to track the younger royals' engagements. They are often publicised in the tabs for instance while royals like Alexandra, the Kents or Edward might be a bit more difficult.

Quote from: snokitty on May 25, 2015, 11:51:19 AM
That is not true.   :no:  On most of the forums W& K& H. are the hottest boards. Not everyone thinks Charles is the most important royal out there.

They may be the hottest threads.

QuoteSounds like you had a modem problem. Why would that be RIF's fault?

I didn't say the problem was with RIF - I said that RIF was the only site that I had the problem with. Since the new modem I am now able to get back onto RIF. I had no problem with any other site at all with the old modem - only this one. Why I don't know - whether it was modem or this site or a combination I will never know.

I was explaining my absence from the board for so long.

QuoteThe CC pads all the royal engagements for everyone but for W& K& H that seems to be the only alternative since they do not work often.

The CC is approved by HM and is the record of what she decides is an official event. All royals do events not listed in the CC.

QuoteExample: William and Kate both have Charlotte's birth appear in the CC as an engagement.

Not an 'engagement' but simply a record that it happened. The reason why George wasn't listed I don't know but Louise and James were also recorded this way as have been most royal babies since the introduction of the CC in the reign of George III.

They also announce the changes to staff appointments - not as engagements but simply as official announcements - along with the date, in advance, of events such as Trooping. Last week they officially announced the date for next year.

QuoteWe aren't looking to get the wrong count with the CC padding on this forum as your friend is on the other forum.

I never said that the poster was my 'friend'.

How is recording everything they do any different to counting the events listed in the CC - the official record. I have read this thread and found that according to this count William had done 53 engagements to the end of April, Kate 24 and Harry 25 but the poster on the other forum - to the end of April had William on 48, Kate on 23 and Harry on 21 based on the CC only. It therefore isn't the CC that is padding the figures but here. The poster there has explained that they only count departures and/or arrivals if there is an official reception also included e.g. if the CC says that someone departed Heathrow for say Australia but nothing official then it doesn't count but if the CC says that someone departed Heathrow and was farewelled by the Ambassador or High Commissioner of the country to be visited then they do count it.

The recognised semi-official count is done annually by Mr O'Donovan, who writes a letter to The Times and The Telegraph, and his figures are usually close to the poster on TRF - who started, if I remember correctly by trying to see how close they could come to Mr O'Donovan's during the Jubilee year. Prior to Mr O'Donovan there was no 'count' as such - just a simple recording. He made doing a count more fashionable and the DM did their own count last year that was different again.

It seems as if what you want to do is count all the official and non-official engagements equally whereas HM only wants to record the official engagements and not the unofficial ones that the family does e.g. when she and Philip went to the theatre a couple of years ago as a private engagement that didn't count because they went for a night out. If they were to go officially then they would have it count. She is able to draw a clear distinction.

QuoteCorrect amount of time earning what they receive is what started this and we can do it our way especially since we are ending the 5th month soon.

How do you know how much preparation they put into the engagement beforehand or is that a simply guess? Without knowing that side of things then there is no way of working out whether they earn what they received - which is zero anyway. They are supported by Charles from the Duchy and not by the Queen from the Sovereign Grant which only covers the official expenses and not the private expenses of the family.

QuoteWe have debated back and forth what is considered justifiable but to debate whether another forum writing down CC numbers would be better than what we are doing just sounds a little asinine IMO.

By all means do what you have been doing.

There was mention of the poster on TRF and that it was clear that that poster's work was being used at one point so I made a suggestion to ask that person if they would mind if that work was also copied here.

There was no need to jump all over a suggestion.

---

Double post auto-merged: May 25, 2015, 01:32:47 PM

---

Quote from: Curryong on May 25, 2015, 11:59:59 AM
But memememe, we discuss many members of the royal family on RI.

It was just that there was discussion a few months about the Cambridges' engagements and how they stacked up over a year, also Harry's. Because the online site dealing with royal engagements isn't particularly reliable and the CC is only printed in a few newspapers it's much easier to track the younger royals' engagements. They are often publicised in the tabs for instance while royals like Alexandra, the Kents or Edward might be a bit more difficult.

The CC did have a glitch earlier this year - true but is pretty much up to date now - only missing two days from that recorded in the papers from last week now.

The poster on TRF has a contact with a subscription to The Times who sends updates when a day is missed e.g. the day that Harry arrived in Australia never had an entry in the print media meaning that it wasn't an official engagement at all. The final day in Australia had both a print and online CC and no mention of any engagement for Harry so HM regards those events as private and not official - her decision only.

Quote from: memememe on May 25, 2015, 09:58:19 AM
I believe that the poster on TRF who does the weekly update includes a record now of 'missing days' from the online CC compared to the print CC and there are now only two days missing - both from last week.

That poster had a list of dates for a number of weeks and progressively the online CC did update all dates -- coincidence or the result of the information out there who knows but having a poster somewhere in the internet calling them out weekly can't have hurt.

I know that the rule here is that you can't copy the posts but has anyone thought to ask that poster if they would object to having the information carried across here??

Hi memememe. Welcome back to RIF. Regarding the tally at TRF, I have messaged one of the posters who works on that very extensive and detailed thread about their information. Their response to me indicated that they'd prefer that RIF do its own tally. :) I'm also sending you a pm with further details on the subject.

---

Double post auto-merged: May 25, 2015, 09:49:22 PM

---

@memememe -Not sure if you had the opportunity to read Canuck's very first post on the thread. In it she explains the "Hows and Whats" for her listing criteria. She is using the CC as a source, but she posts an * on private engagements that the public are made of aware but are not listed in  the CC. For example: Harry's trip to the French Embassy to sign a condolence book for the Charlie Hebdo massacre.

She does not want to put an actual number on the engagements either knowing that there is discussion as to what is being counted by Mr. Donovan's annual tally and on other sites.  :)

@memememe-BTW forgot to add earlier that Canuck like the posters at TRF are aware of the issues involving the British Monarchy's official website and its failure to keep the site updated with all of the working members' engagements. So she is trying her best to ascertain when engagements took place through media sites too.

Update for May.

A note regarding Charlotte's birth:  it was listed in the CC, though I don't think that's indication that the BRF considers it an engagement -- more just a mark of an important event in the family, like the CC lists the Queen's birthday every year.  (Interestingly, although most Royal births have been similarly listed, e.g. when Sophie's kids were born, for some reason George's birth was not listed, or at least not in the online CC, which must have been an oversight.)  Since it's not an actual official engagement, I've not included it in the normal way.  I have, however, listed the hospital steps photocall with an asterisk for both Will and Kate.  That's an unofficial event, but it's part of the Royal role and took about as long as signing books of condolence do.  As always, people are free to count it or not in their own tallies.

And regarding this past weekend's outings:  the online CC hasn't updated yet so I don't know how many engagements it will ultimately credit to Will and Harry (sometimes polo is listed and sometimes not; additionally, while Will's attendance at the FA cup will definitely be an engagement, it's possible he will get a separate one for the FA meeting he spoke at before the match).  For now I've done my best guess, but it may need to be adjusted later based on the CC.

JANUARY

Will
None

Kate
January 15: Clore Art Room opening
January 16: Fostering Network visit
January 19: Family Friends coffee
January 19: Kensington Aldridge Academy visit
January 19: Kensington Leisure Centre opening

Harry
*January 9: signed book of condolence for Charlie Hebdo
January 14: Coach Core graduation session
*January 23: met with 65 Degrees North (ice cap challenge team)

FEBRUARY

Will
February 24: investiture at BP
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: departed Heathrow for Japan
February 26: arrived in Japan/greeted by British ambassador
February 26: boat tour with Governor of Tokyo
February 26: tea ceremony in Hama-rikyu Gardens
February 27: lay wreath at Commonwealth cemetery
February 27: lunch with Emperor and Empress of Japan at Imperial Palace
February 27: meeting with Crown Prince and Crown Princess of Japan at Akasaka Palace
February 27: Innovation is Great launch in Tokyo
February 27: reception at British Embassy in Tokyo
February 28: visit to NHK Broadcasting Studio in Tokyo
February 28: visit to Innovation is Great display at T-Site Multimedia Store
February 28: visit to Smile Kids Park in Fukushima (with President of Japan)
February 28: dinner given by President of Japan

Kate
February 10: Bethlem and Maudsley school visit
February 11: KP reception for Palliative Care Programme for Children and Young People
February 12: visit to Ben Ainslie Racing Office in Whiteley
February 12: visit to site of new Ben Ainslie Racing Base Headquarters
February 12: reception for 1851 Trust at Spinnaker Tower
February 18: visit to Emma Bridgewater factory for EACH
February 18: visit to Action for Children at Cape Hill Children's Centre
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: received outgoing director of the National Portrait Gallery

Harry
February 1: RFU injured players training session
February 3: visit to Full Effect program
February 24: Royal Foundation Chairman's Dinner at KP
February 25: visit to Northumberland Wildlife Trust's Red Squirrels project
February 25: visit to Avondale House veterans charity

MARCH

Will
March 1: visit to Ishinomaki NewSea building
March 1: lay wreath at Hoyoriyama Hill Vantage Point
March 1: visit to Chime of Hope Market in Onagawa
March 1: visit Matsushima Airbase in Miyagi Prefecture
March 1: depart Tokyo and arrive Beijing/greeted by British ambassador
March 2: meeting with President of China
March 2: visit to Forbidden City
March 2: meeting with Vice President of China
March 2: opening of GREAT Festival of Creativity in Shanghai
March 2: received Founder/Executive Chairman of the Alibaba Group
March 2: received Chairman of Wanda Group
March 2: received Chairman of Sanpower
March 3: attended GREAT Festival of Creativity
March 3: Premier Skills event at Nanyang School
March 3: attend Education UK's Alumni Awards Ceremony
March 3: reopening of Heritage Building at Intercontinental Shanghai
March 3: International Wildlife Trafficking Meeting with NGOs
March 3: opened British Centre
March 3: Chinese premiere of the film Paddington
March 3: dinner for GREAT Festival
March 4: visit to Mengman Village, Xishuangbanna Dai Autonomous Prefecture
March 4: visit to Asian Elephant Sanctuary
March 4: visit to Wild Elephant Valley
March 4: visit to Xishuangbanna Tropical Botanical Gardens
March 4: attended Conservation on the Border Conference
March 4: departed Hong Kong for Britain
March 5: arrived at Heathrow
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Horse Guards Parade
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
*March 18: attend meetings with ambassadors with the Queen
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate
March 27: meeting of the Royal Foundation

Kate
March 9: Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey
March 11: visit to Turner Contemporary gallery
March 11: visit to Resort Studios in Margate
March 12: visit to set of Downton Abbey/Ealing Studios
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 17: presentation of shamrocks to Irish Guards
March 18: visit to Home-Start at Brookhill Children's Centre
March 27: visit to Stephen Lawrence Centre
March 27: visit to XLP in Gipsy Hill
March 27: visit to XLP mobile unit at Hazel Grove Estate

Harry
March 13: Afghanistan commemoration service at St. Paul's
March 13: reception at Guildhall
March 18: reception for Walking for the Wounded
March 21: rugby match between England and France

APRIL

Will
April 25: Gallipoli wreath laying ceremony

Kate
None

Harry
April 6: visit to Australian War Memorial
April 22: arrived in Istanbul
April 24: reception on HMS Bulwark
April 24: attended international service at Abide
April 24: attended Commonwealth and Ireland service at Helles
April 24: attended French service at Morto Bay
April 25: attended dawn service at ANZAC Cove
April 25: attended breakfast reception
April 25: attended Australian service at Lone Pine
April 25: attended Service of Thanksgiving at the 57th Regiment Memorial
April 25: attended New Zealand service at Chunuk Bair
April 25: arrived in UK from Turkey
April 26: presented prizes at London marathon

MAY

Will
*May 1: sign book of condolence for Nepal earthquake
*May 2: hospital photocall with baby Charlotte
May 18: depart Heathrow and arrive in Geneva/greeted by British Ambassador
May 18: meeting of United for Wildlife Taskforce on trafficking of illegal wildlife products
May 18: meeting of United for Wildlife Council
May 18: depart Geneva and arrive Heathrow
May 19: investiture at Windsor Castle
May 20: visit women's World Cup team/Homeless FA training session
May 21: investiture at BP
May 21: meeting with D/Dss of Cambridge scholarship recipients at KP
May 21: Tusk Trust anniversary dinner
May 22: lunch for Defence and National Rehabilitation Centre
May 30: attend/speak at FA Cup final
May 31: Audi Polo Challenge

Kate
*May 2: hospital photocall with baby Charlotte

Harry
May 9: arrived in New Zealand/greeted by Prime Minister
May 9: reception at Government House
May 9: laid wreath at War Memorial in Wellington
*May 9: attend rugby game
May 10: welcome at Invercargill Airport
May 10: visit to Stewart Island and Ulva Island
May 10: church service on Stewart Island
May 11: visit Halfmoon Bay School on Stewart Island
May 12: tram ride in Christchurch accompanied by Prime Minister
May 12: visit to Quake City Exhibition/Re:Start Container Mall
May 12: meet with Student Volunteer Army at University of Canterbury
May 13: visit to Odyssey House in Christchurch
May 13: visit to Linton Military Camp
May 14: visit to Putiki Marae in Whanganui
May 14: cross Whanganui river in Maori canoe
May 14: attend veterans reception at War Memorial Centre in Whanganui
May 15: attend performance at Southern Cross Campus in Auckland
May 15: visit to New Zealand Rugby Foundation at the Auckland Spinal Rehabilitation Unit
May 15: visit Turn Your Life Around program in Otara
May 15: receive Leader of the Opposition
May 15: receive Prime Minister
May 15: attend Emergency Services Reception
May 16: visit to FIFA u-20 youth program
May 16: visit to High Performance Sport New Zealand
May 16: depart Auckland for UK
May 17: arrive at Heathrow
May 18: visit Sentebale garden at Chelsea Flower Show
May 24: Maserati Jerudong Park polo
May 31: Audi Polo Challenge

Thanks Canuck.  And lovely to see you!

Personally, I find listing two separate engagements of "promoting football" and "playing football with kids" for a single actual event to be a far more creative way of padding out a Royal's resume, but to each their own.   :shrug:

Quote from: Macrobug on June 01, 2015, 10:07:12 PM
Thanks Canuck.  And lovely to see you!

Wonderful to see you @Cancuk and thank you for updating the list for the trio.

Thanks for your hard work in compiling this, Canuck!  :thumbsup:

@Canuck-IMO the real intention of the Court Circular has always been to inform the public of what the British royal family is participating in on a daily basis and to make announcements ie: births, arrivals/departures, wedding engagements etc..You and Macrobug have pointed this out twice in this thread. Actually until Mr. O'Donovan began writing his annual letter to the Times, I don't believe that too many royal watchers were keeping an account of how many engagements were performed. The BRF apparently does have some friendly competitions going on among its fiercest competitors ie: DoE/Princess Royal, but the function of the Court Circular continues much in the same way as it has for decades.

Quote from: TLLK on June 01, 2015, 11:01:37 PM

Quote from: Macrobug on June 01, 2015, 10:07:12 PM
Thanks Canuck.  And lovely to see you!

Wonderful to see you @Cancuk and thank you for updating the list for the trio.

Ditto @Canuck. Soooo glad to see you post! Missed you. You too Macro, haven't seen you on here lately either.

Hadn't realized that the Court Circular acknowledges HM's birthday. This confirms my belief that the CC is used primarily as a form of communication rather than a "tally."

The court circular mentions all RF members birthdays, engagements, pregnancy announcements etc. It isn't  working as a tally sheet, there were complains that two of Mates engagements  pre delivery didn't  make it on the CC so whoever is updating and managing that website  needs to gove RIF a call. We can do it better, and what is with that outdated design, get someone on that ASAP.

Quote from: TLLK on June 01, 2015, 11:59:13 PM
@Canuck-IMO the real intention of the Court Circular has always been to inform the public of what the British royal family is participating in on a daily basis and to make announcements ie: births, arrivals/departures, wedding engagements etc..You and Macrobug have pointed this out twice in this thread. Actually until Mr. O'Donovan began writing his annual letter to the Times, I don't believe that too many royal watchers were keeping an account of how many engagements were performed. The BRF apparently does have some friendly competitions going on among its fiercest competitors ie: DoE/Princess Royal, but the function of the Court Circular continues much in the same way as it has for decades.

I would say that it is meant as a form of communication certainly.  The press tend to "notice the number of engagements" because it is a way of filling up their pages with "who is the hardest worker" among the royals and "what work do they do".. I'm sure the RF DO recognise that it is important that they can point to figures of how much work they do, but they are not "dotting every I and crossing every t" with this.. They put out a certain amount of information and feel that that proves to the public that they are out there doing their   job and not having fun all the time...but they dotn feel the need to mention everything and expect that if there is a reasonable amount of information available to the public, in relation to their engagements, the public will accept that they are working and not idle...

You're very welcome, all, and good to see you too!  I haven't been posting much lately but I did want to keep this updated as I know some people use it as a resource to avoid the terrible CC website.

Quote from: snokitty on June 01, 2015, 10:26:44 PM
Yes those have a lot of padding so they must be from the CC.   :P

Oh... I think this was covered earlier in the thread... let me find it.... ooh.. yep, here it is:

Quote from: snokitty on May 25, 2015, 04:03:54 PM
^ If you don't care for the way we have chosen to do this count then you are not required to read it.

Quote from: tiaras on June 02, 2015, 05:34:02 AM
The court circular mentions all RF members birthdays, engagements, pregnancy announcements etc. It isn't  working as a tally sheet, there were complains that two of Mates engagements  pre delivery didn't  make it on the CC so whoever is updating and managing that website  needs to gove RIF a call. We can do it better, and what is with that outdated design, get someone on that ASAP.

I get the feeling that the person assigned to the Court Circular is required to write it out with a quill pen and a bottle of ink. :lol:

Quote from: Canuck on June 02, 2015, 12:20:39 PM
You're very welcome, all, and good to see you too!  I haven't been posting much lately but I did want to keep this updated as I know some people use it as a resource to avoid the terrible CC website.

Looking forward to your June wrap up @Canuck as it will cover the events for Ascot, Garter Ceremony and Trooping the Color. :thumbsup: Bring on the pageantry and fanciful hats! :D