Duke & Duchess - To Clear Their Calendars for August (Threads Merged)

[cinrit]

Who creates the demand for which the press obliges? 

The buying public creates the demand.  And the media knows their customers and what will sell.  If they didn't know that, they wouldn't last very long.

Cindy

[DaisyMeRollin]

Well, I think of all the Royal families, the BRF naturally attracts more attention because the Queen is still the head of state in 16 countries.  Additionally, the U.S. has a particular interest in the BRF (I suspect some of this is down to the country's fascination with Princess Diana, and some because of its own history with England).  And then the BRF has probably the best known history of the various Royal families, from Richard III to Henry VIII to the Edward/Wallis Simpson episode to the BRF in WWII (much of which has been popularized in books, movies, Shakespeare, etc.).  They do pageantry extremely well, which helps to keep interest up, and they're English speaking, which makes them easier to follow for the portions of the public in other countries that speak English.  So I suspect it's a combination of a lot of different factors.

There's a very simple answer to this.

Anyway, when comparing the BRF and the SRF, I think you have took take a look at their respective societies to find a few answers also. Monarchists can't even come to a consensus on whether they want a minimalist monarchy or what the definition of a modern monarchy should be when it comes to the BRF.

They do pageantry extremely well, which helps to keep interest up

Is it necessary? If people stopped sitting in slack-jawed awe of the parades, would we see more worthwhile contributions?  On the outside looking in, I think Monarchists and Republicans say a lot even when saying so little when it comes to their observations of their own or other respective monarchies.  Sometimes I think, if the public themselves weren't intrusive, bloodthirsty, and showed even an iota of consistency, then the BRF could actually have a modern monarchy. There's a compromise, but it starts with the people. Until Britain finds that compromise, I sympathize with people with Republican sentiments. It's antiquated and it's a waste.

Sweden's national holiday seems more subdued, and the weddings are more subdued. The Nobel ceremony and dinner allots a little glitz and glamour.  I think it's more of a progressive and pragmatic approach to monarchy that is reflective of the people of Sweden.

The buying public creates the demand.  And the media knows their customers and what will sell.  If they didn't know that, they wouldn't last very long.

Cindy

DING DING DING! Give that lady a cookie!

Can't really complain about "intrusiveness" when you eagerly lap it up and continue the cycle.

[HistoryGirl]

^Completely agree on the last portion with the comparison to the SRF.

[Canuck]

I feel like we're talking past each other, Daisy.  Like cinrit, I'm saying the BRF attracts the most attention because they're the family the general public is most interested in and will buy/pay attention to news about.  I was just trying to explain some of the reasons I thought that might be the case.

[HistoryGirl]

I think what Daisy is saying is that the people that complain about intrusiveness are part of the problem. (of course, my impression could be totally wrong and if it is I apologize lol)

[Canuck]

If so, HistoryGirl, then I disagree.  I like to follow the BRF, but I don't buy the tell-all books or seek out the paparazzi pictures (I made a particular point of avoiding the sunbathing pictures of Kate, which I thought were an appalling breach of privacy).  Yes, being a monarchy people have interest in creates demand for privacy violations; but it is not the case that all fame necessitates privacy violations.  There are various ways that those privacy violations can be curtailed:  the UK's laws, members of the public choosing not to consume privacy-violating pictures, the media self-regulating, and the BRF itself setting limits on the extent to which they are exposed and in the public eye.  I think W&K are simply trying to do the latter.

[HistoryGirl]

But then that goes back to the issue of fame not being a faucet. It can't be that ppl only buy the papers when they go out on engagements because it's all a cycle. People want to see them because they somehow feel closeness to them. As if seeing pictures of George makes ppl feel part of his childhood. That "personal" connection will then transfer when George does engagements later on.

If the whole hoopla with Diana and Charles had never occurred and we hadn't seen her be so loving to the princes and teaching them to be "normal" and then the unfortunate and tragic death that then created sympathy and interest which led us to care about their private lives and uplifted their status as far as intrigue from media because ppl cared about them. They were princes so it would have happened anyway, but perhaps not to that extent.

The point, however, is that the media cares because the public wants to see. And the public want to see because they somehow feel like they "know" the family, which is part of the game that royals need to play because popularity is what they crave and need. ‎

[DaisyMeRollin]

I feel like we're talking past each other, Daisy.  Like cinrit, I'm saying the BRF attracts the most attention because they're the family the general public is most interested in and will buy/pay attention to news about.  I was just trying to explain some of the reasons I thought that might be the case.

It's not a problem. I understand the "why". I just wanted to see who would point the finger to themselves, too.

What I'm wondering is, what would make the situation better? We're talking about the compromise that Victoria and Daniel have, maybe the BRF should actually harness a more stream-lined and austere approach to be a progressive monarchy. Unfortunately, will the British public allow that since they have expectations of pomp and pageantry that surpass that of other monarchies?

I think what Daisy is saying is that the people that complain about intrusiveness are part of the problem. (of course, my impression could be totally wrong and if it is I apologize lol)

Got it!

[Canuck]

Well yes, fame isn't a faucet you can turn on and off, and the BRF relies on the public feeling a connection to them.  But at the same time, it's about striking a balance.  I don't think releasing hundreds more pictures or taking George to a dozen public engagements a year would reduce the intrusiveness of the press; I don't think that W&K's efforts to protect their child's privacy are turning off the general public or reducing the popularity of George or the BRF (quite the opposite, according to public opinion polls).

[DaisyMeRollin]

HG,  :goodpost:

Whenever I mull this over, I start wondering at what point are they celebrities? Where's the divide really?

[HistoryGirl]

No, but like I said I don't care what they do with George, it's not my kid lol the difference is the hostility that they seem to have as opposed to Victoria and Daniel. And I realize that Diana was harassed and William and Harry hold a grudge toward the press. But Daniel absolutely hated the attention too when the relationship first started and I've never had an eating disorder, but I'm willing to bet having to admit you have one to the press must have been hard for Victoria, but she sucked it up and talked to them about it, not held all journalists accountable for reporting on it.

Again, William and Kate and the BRF can do it anyway they want, but from my personal standpoint I just think the Swedes have achieved a version of a modern monarchy quite well.
Double post auto-merged: August 03, 2014, 11:55:47 PM

HG,  :goodpost:

Whenever I mull this over, I start wondering at what point are they celebrities? Where's the divide really?

In this day and age you can't really tell anymore. Even politicians are starting to seem like celebrities. Probably because of the growth of celebrity culture in general with social media.

[DaisyMeRollin]

Haha! The last portion! Too true.

I was fumbling with the idea of making the comparison to a few politicians (both US Republican and Democrat), but I thought that maybe we should avoid it. What a mess!

[cinrit]

DING DING DING! Give that lady a cookie!

Can't really complain about "intrusiveness" when you eagerly lap it up and continue the cycle. 

Ah, but I wasn't complaining, though personally, I could since I'm not into buying magazines and books (or especially tabloids) about the Royals.  I was simply answering a question put forth by you.  I don't think anyone has actually "complained" about the media.  So, no, I didn't point fingers at anyone.

Cindy

[DaisyMeRollin]

^^^I think I need to avoid using the royal "you". That's causing confusion. I wasn't specifically talking about "you" as in you, Cinrit, I was speaking generally.^^^

Forum misinterpretations. What are you going to do?  :shrug:

[wannable]

Daniel and Victoria do not make the cut in the 100, nor 200 most searched people in yahoo, google, bing, any search engine, but William, Kate and George are, that to publicist and marketing is pictures worth thousands.

Estelle pic is very likely worth penny's or for free to keep them in centre fold, as cruel as it may sound.

Of course, the oldest firm in the planet, the BRF know what they're  doing. George very likely already has his piggy bank, his website name taken, etc. they control the pics to be distributed, embargoed until date/time,  the press are mad, no money. Just read them in twitter, pist.  And still the press places them front page news, because the masses buy and click. The BRF has the pulse.

[HistoryGirl]

It is quite a mess. I don't think it's necessary to buy books to contribute though, clicking on articles is the same thing; watching their weddings on tv; joining a forum about them. I think it just is what it is, people are interested and that's how it'll remain. Id say they should look at the way the Swedes do it, but I don't think they want to. They rather enjoy being the most prominent house, just not when it doesnt suit them lol as with everyone I suppose. ‎I do think Daisy's point of Swedish ppl's culture is a big factor. The Swedes have a value for moderation and focus on education and a state that is there to help the people (truly, not just the lip service) and that then translates to their monarchy being more modest and thoughtful towards their public. 

I think there are sensible Brits that want this focus to shift to the welfare of the people and education, but not enough to actually change which is why their House reflects that same hold on tradition and pomp and circumstance. That's their choice entirely though. ‎

[PrincessOfPeace]

DING DING DING! Give that lady a cookie!

Can't really complain about "intrusiveness" when you eagerly lap it up and continue the cycle. 

Ah, but I wasn't complaining, though personally, I could since I'm not into buying magazines and books (or especially tabloids) about the Royals.  I was simply answering a question put forth by you.  I don't think anyone has actually "complained" about the media.  So, no, I didn't point fingers at anyone.

Cindy

  :goodpost: I don't buy the trashier titles but I do admit to buying commemorative issues on William's and Kate's wedding and of course little Prince George on his birthday   :vday2:

[DaisyMeRollin]

Daniel and Victoria do not make the cut in the 100, nor 200 most searched people in yahoo, google, bing, any search engine, but William, Kate and George are, that to publicist and marketing is pictures worth thousands.

Estelle pic is very likely worth penny's or for free to keep them in centre fold, as cruel as it may sound.

Of course, the oldest firm in the planet, the BRF know what their doing. George very likely already has his piggy bank, his website name taken, etc. they control the pics to be distributed, the press are mad, no money. Just read them in twitter, pist.

If this is in reference to the conversation at hand, as far as "intrusion". Posting here and the bolded:

<----- the point

you ----->

It is quite a mess. I don't think it's necessary to buy books to contribute though, clicking on articles is the same thing; watching their weddings on tv; joining a forum about them. I think it just is what it is, people are interested and that's how it'll remain. Id say they should look at the way the Swedes do it, but I don't think they want to. They rather enjoy being the most prominent house, just not when it doesnt suit them lol as with everyone I suppose. ‎I do think Daisy's point of Swedish ppl's culture is a big factor. The Swedes have a value for moderation and focus on education and a state that is there to help the people (truly, not just the lip service) and that then translates to their monarchy being more modest and thoughtful towards their public.

I think there are sensible Brits that want this focus to shift to the welfare of the people and education, but not enough to actually change which is why their House reflects that same hold on tradition and pomp and circumstance. That's their choice entirely though. ‎

The bolded is exactly what I've suspected too. It's all circular.

[PrincessOfPeace]

Daniel and Victoria do not make the cut in the 100, nor 200 most searched people in yahoo, google, bing, any search engine, but William, Kate and George are, that to publicist and marketing is pictures worth thousands.

Estelle pic is very likely worth penny's or for free to keep them in centre fold, as cruel as it may sound.

Of course, the oldest firm in the planet, the BRF know what they're  doing. George very likely already has his piggy bank, his website name taken, etc. they control the pics to be distributed, embargoed until date/time,  the press are mad, no money. Just read them in twitter, pist.  And still the press places them front page news, because the masses buy and click. The BRF has the pulse.

I agree.  :goodpost:

[wannable]

The media would like to make more money out of George yes, not through only the controlled embargoes from the BRF.

I think the Cambridge's are doing the right thing.

[HistoryGirl]

I think Daisy and I are discussing something completely different to everyone else lol where would one create a thread to compare the SRF and the BRF?

[DaisyMeRollin]

I think Daisy and I are discussing something completely different to everyone else lol where would one create a thread to compare the SRF and the BRF?

I wouldn't mind it. It gets a little dicey in the compare and contrast when it starts degenerating into the "Go team!"  mentality. That's my only apprehension.

[HistoryGirl]

^True, maybe it's better to just leave it there.

[good221]

Clear what in their calendar, when there is nothing there to being with???? What!! :notamused:

[Limabeany]

Daniel and Victoria do not make the cut in the 100, nor 200 most searched people in yahoo, google, bing, any search engine, but William, Kate and George are, that to publicist and marketing is pictures worth thousands.

Daniel and Vidtoria aren't among the most searched people, but I consider them among the most thoughtful royal parents with their subjects and William and Kate, the most selfish and entitled. No one is claiming the entitled pair should be more thoughtful for the pr, pr is what parading their son through Oz like his mother tour looked like, thoughtfulness is what Estelle's upbringing looks like.