Prince William Holds Investiture Ceremony at BP

Started by Canuck, February 24, 2015, 05:05:24 PM

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Canuck

February 24, 2015, 05:05:24 PM Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 01:06:46 PM by SophieChloe
Will did the investiture ceremony at BP today, where recipients included James Caan (a businessman formerly on the Dragon's Den television show) and Nikki Gewirtz (a jewelry designer, Kate has worn some of her pieces in the past).  The DM talked to Caan, who seemed thrilled to be there:

QuoteThe business mogul received a CBE for services to entrepreneurship and charitable services through his James Caan Foundation.

James, 54, who was born in Pakistan but moved to the UK aged two and now resides in London, said: 'He said to me "we miss you on Dragons' Den"'.

It is not clear who the 'we' refers to but it suggest that the Duke might enjoy the show with his wife the Duchess of Cambridge, Kate - unless of course it is the royal 'we'.

The entrepreneur added that it was a delight to meet the Prince and it served as a reminder of the importance of British heritage.   

He said: 'It was amazing to meet the Duke. He is just so charming.'

Prince William admits he's fan of Dragons' Den to James Caan as he's awarded a CBE | Daily Mail Online

TLLK

#1
February 24, 2015, 05:12:53 PM
Thank you for finding this Canuck.

Macrobug

#2
February 24, 2015, 05:27:36 PM
The Queen seems to have handed off these events to William and Charles.  Standing for that length of time but be getting hard for her
GNU Terry Pratchett

Canuck

#3
February 24, 2015, 05:35:05 PM
I think you're right, Macrobug.  When the investitures are happening there tend to be 3 or 4 of them in the same month, and the Queen hasn't done more than one in each of those months for at least the past year.  Charles does most of them now, with Will taking the next-most and Anne doing the occasional one.

Limabeany

#4
February 24, 2015, 06:11:01 PM
William has done less than a handful from what has been reported, so Charles does the bulk.
"You don't have to be pretty. You don't owe prettiness to anyone. Not to your boyfriend/spouse/partner, not to your co-workers, especially not to random men on the street. You don't owe it to your mother, you don't owe it to your children, you don't owe it to civilization in general. Prettiness is not a rent you pay for occupying a space marked 'female'." Diana Vreeland.

TLLK

#5
February 24, 2015, 06:22:32 PM
Quote from: Macrobug on February 24, 2015, 05:27:36 PM
The Queen seems to have handed off these events to William and Charles.  Standing for that length of time but be getting hard for her
Yes it does seem that way. With the PoW, PR and DoCam sharing this role with her then HM can opt out of those tasks that are physically taxing.

Canuck

#6
February 24, 2015, 07:31:27 PM
Quote from: Limabeany on February 24, 2015, 06:11:01 PM
William has done less than a handful from what has been reported, so Charles does the bulk.

I agree Charles does the majority.  But this is Will's 10th since he began doing them in late 2013 (just under a year and a half ago), which I would say is more than "a handful".  The Queen herself has only done 12 in the same period of time, and that's been declining over time.  There's a pretty clear trend of the Queen handing off this responsibility ever more frequently, and while Charles is taking on the bulk of the responsibility it also seems clear that Will is going to step into the supporting role on this.

SophieChloe

#7
February 24, 2015, 08:46:10 PM Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 08:49:49 PM by SophieChloe
The invisible man stands on a step and makes small talk for a while.  :orchid:  Nothing more than reminding us that he still exists.  What a joke! 
Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me

Lady Adams

#8
February 24, 2015, 09:16:53 PM
Quote from: Canuck on February 24, 2015, 07:31:27 PM
Quote from: Limabeany on February 24, 2015, 06:11:01 PM
William has done less than a handful from what has been reported, so Charles does the bulk.

I agree Charles does the majority.  But this is Will's 10th since he began doing them in late 2013 (just under a year and a half ago), which I would say is more than "a handful".  The Queen herself has only done 12 in the same period of time, and that's been declining over time.  There's a pretty clear trend of the Queen handing off this responsibility ever more frequently, and while Charles is taking on the bulk of the responsibility it also seems clear that Will is going to step into the supporting role on this.
Doesn't Anne do a significant number?  She's such a fly-under-the-radar royal.
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." --Elbert Hubbard, American writer

SophieChloe

#9
February 24, 2015, 09:20:05 PM
^ She doesn't need to *bump* her numbers up.
Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me

Canuck

#10
February 24, 2015, 09:22:53 PM
Anne has done 6 investitures since October 1, 2013.  Half of those took place overseas (it's common for a Royal on tour to do investitures while they are in a foreign country; Harry, for example, has not done any investitures at home, but did do one during his Oman trip).

TLLK

#11
February 24, 2015, 09:40:31 PM
Quote from: Lady Adams on February 24, 2015, 09:16:53 PM
Quote from: Canuck on February 24, 2015, 07:31:27 PM
Quote from: Limabeany on February 24, 2015, 06:11:01 PM
William has done less than a handful from what has been reported, so Charles does the bulk.

I agree Charles does the majority.  But this is Will's 10th since he began doing them in late 2013 (just under a year and a half ago), which I would say is more than "a handful".  The Queen herself has only done 12 in the same period of time, and that's been declining over time.  There's a pretty clear trend of the Queen handing off this responsibility ever more frequently, and while Charles is taking on the bulk of the responsibility it also seems clear that Will is going to step into the supporting role on this.
Doesn't Anne do a significant number?  She's such a fly-under-the-radar royal.
It is possible that Anne will choose to hand this task off to Charles and Son in the coming years now that William is older.

Limabeany

#12
February 24, 2015, 11:49:48 PM
Quote from: Canuck on February 24, 2015, 07:31:27 PM
Quote from: Limabeany on February 24, 2015, 06:11:01 PM
William has done less than a handful from what has been reported, so Charles does the bulk.

I agree Charles does the majority.  But this is Will's 10th since he began doing them in late 2013 (just under a year and a half ago), which I would say is more than "a handful".  The Queen herself has only done 12 in the same period of time, and that's been declining over time.  There's a pretty clear trend of the Queen handing off this responsibility ever more frequently, and while Charles is taking on the bulk of the responsibility it also seems clear that Will is going to step into the supporting role on this.
It is a handful considering he did nothing but take a few weeks course the entire gap year... And the traveling...
"You don't have to be pretty. You don't owe prettiness to anyone. Not to your boyfriend/spouse/partner, not to your co-workers, especially not to random men on the street. You don't owe it to your mother, you don't owe it to your children, you don't owe it to civilization in general. Prettiness is not a rent you pay for occupying a space marked 'female'." Diana Vreeland.

Canuck

#13
February 24, 2015, 11:51:55 PM
But we weren't talking about whether Will's overall schedule was busy enough, we were talking about how the investitures have been distributed among members of the BRF.  Charles is certainly doing the most, but Will is up there with the Queen for next-most -- and since she's cutting back, he's clearly stepping into the supporting role behind Charles for this particular type of work.

Limabeany

#14
February 25, 2015, 12:05:09 AM
He is 'up there' because his numbers rival a woman almost in her 90's?  :hmm:
"You don't have to be pretty. You don't owe prettiness to anyone. Not to your boyfriend/spouse/partner, not to your co-workers, especially not to random men on the street. You don't owe it to your mother, you don't owe it to your children, you don't owe it to civilization in general. Prettiness is not a rent you pay for occupying a space marked 'female'." Diana Vreeland.

TLLK

#15
February 25, 2015, 12:23:01 AM
Quote from: Canuck on February 24, 2015, 11:51:55 PM
But we weren't talking about whether Will's overall schedule was busy enough, we were talking about how the investitures have been distributed among members of the BRF.  Charles is certainly doing the most, but Will is up there with the Queen for next-most -- and since she's cutting back, he's clearly stepping into the supporting role behind Charles for this particular type of work.
I'm considering this part of William's "on the job training," for his future role. With the UK in an unusual position of having an adult heir and heir-to-the-heir it makes sense IMO to have him participating in this type of task.

Lady Adams

#16
February 25, 2015, 01:15:02 AM
Quote from: Canuck on February 24, 2015, 09:22:53 PM
Anne has done 6 investitures since October 1, 2013.  Half of those took place overseas (it's common for a Royal on tour to do investitures while they are in a foreign country; Harry, for example, has not done any investitures at home, but did do one during his Oman trip).
She's patron to over 140 organizations, and still manages to squeeze in 6 investitures? Wow.

I'm sorry, but William's number of investitures is embarrassing compared to those stats.
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." --Elbert Hubbard, American writer

Canuck

#17
February 25, 2015, 02:03:36 AM
I'm not sure why anyone is acting as though investitures are a measure of overall work.  They're interesting as a specific type of (ceremonial and traditional) role, and because we know for certain that when someone other than the Queen does one it is because she delegated it to that person, seeing the torch passed from old Royals to younger ones IMO reveals something about the BRF's thinking.  But whether it's Anne or Will or the Queen, a half dozen investitures is a very small slice of total engagements and doesn't really have anything to do with broader workload.

Lady Adams

#18
February 25, 2015, 03:07:04 AM
I absolutely think that investitures should be use as a measure of overall work.

We hear so often that the Queen is, apparently, not ready to pass along her workload, and that is why William and Kate are not full-time royals. But here is a role that HM has quite clearly said she cannot do; they are important to her, and clearly to those members of the UK who receive them. Yet, William still only does ten investitures? That's paltry, given the little amount of work his does for his patronages-- and his 17 month+ transitional year.

When you compare those numbers to Anne's-- one of the hardest working royals of the family-- who still managed to do 6 in the same time period, it's even more disgraceful.
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." --Elbert Hubbard, American writer

Macrobug

#19
February 25, 2015, 03:49:11 AM
How many do you think they do in a year?  They aren't going to ramp up the number of them just so William will do more. 
GNU Terry Pratchett

Lady Adams

#20
February 25, 2015, 04:16:01 AM
^^ Well, we don't really need to guess, because we've got the Court Circular at our finger tips.  :wink:

In 2014, there were 35 investitures.

Queen- 8
Prince Charles- 11
Princess Anne- 5
Prince Andrew- 1
Prince William- 8
Prince Harry- 1
Duke of Gloucester- 1

So look, it's great that William-- while having no other job except studying-- was able to pull off the same amount of investitures as his elderly grandmother. But if Anne, who has over 140 patronages can still manage to squeeze in 5 of them, I think William can take on more without them having to "ramp up" the number of investiture ceremonies.
"To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing." --Elbert Hubbard, American writer

Macrobug

#21
February 25, 2015, 04:21:18 AM
 :P Thanks for looking up the number - I was trying to find it but was distracted by a TV show

But it shows that William is doing some of the investitures.  It looks like they are dividing them up among themselves - who knows - maybe the Queen still wants to do some.
GNU Terry Pratchett

Canuck

#22
February 25, 2015, 05:27:31 AM Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 06:34:37 AM by Canuck
What those numbers show me is that in 2014, Will was tied for the second most investitures -- Charles (obviously) doing the most at 11, and Will and the Queen both doing 8.  The Queen is clearly transitioning to doing fewer at the same time that Will has begun taking part in these events.  If in his first full year of doing them he did as many as the Queen herself, I think it's likely that as the Queen continues to wind down the number she does Will will continue to take on more.

The thing I don't understand is treating investitures as though they are (a) within the control of individual Royals (they're not -- they are the Queen's responsibility, which she delegates to particular Royals as she sees fit) and (b) something completely fungible (there are reasons particular Royals have to do particular ceremonies -- Will can't very well take the three Anne did while on overseas trips, for example, and there are sometimes reasons a particular investiture needs to be done by the Queen herself, such as when they are part of a larger ceremonial occasion).  I likewise don't understand treating investitures as though they have any meaningful impact on overall engagement totals -- as is clear from the numbers posted, even if Will had done the same number as the person who did the greatest number of them (the actual heir), he would have added a whopping 3 engagements to the 143 he did last year.  In other words, these numbers are basically meaningless to the overall engagement tally.  If you think Will should be doing more (which is obviously an opinion people are free to hold), investitures really wouldn't be the way to correct that.
Double post auto-merged: February 25, 2015, 06:34:37 AM


It occurred to me that it would be interesting to get some perspective by comparing the 2014 numbers to 2013.  In that year, there were a total of 33 investitures, done by the following people:

Queen - 13
Charles - 12 (one overseas)
Anne - 3
Edward - 2 (one overseas)
Will - 2 (began doing them in October)
Duke of Gloucester - 1

So between 2013 and 2014, Charles did about the same and Anne added two (but actually did one fewer in the UK than in 2013).  Meanwhile, the Queen decreased her load from 13 to 8 while Will went from 2 to 8 -- taking all of the Queen's reduced workload, plus the one domestic investiture Anne reduced her 2013 tally by.  That actually makes it very clear that Will has indeed been the individual they've stepped up to fill the gaps created by the Queen slowing down in this area.

Also of note:  of the 8 investiture the Queen did in 2014, one was during an overseas trip (France), one was Hollyrood, and 3 others involved special circumstances for which the Queen likely needed to do the ceremony personally (twice knighting/conferring Dame status on a Governor General, and once investing the Royal Victorian Order).  There were really only 3 normal investitures that the Queen did in 2014, which is a substantial reduction for her.
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