How The Duchess of Cornwall Won Our Hearts

[FanDianaFancy]

cate says  it better thatn  I have  said it over and over.

Camilla, the Rotweiller  will be Queen Camllia.

Princess Camilla married to King  Charles is  silly, not  appropriate, lacks status and rank  in the world of the Brit  nobility/aristos who are her  subjects yet, peers  to a point, and YES, in the eyes  of the world  to heads of state, crowned heads of  Europe, Camilla will be known as Queen  Camilla and nothing else.

Period!!
Double post auto-merged: September 23, 2014, 10:59:49 PM

Consort formally.

[amabel]

yes it is highy likely that she will be known as queen.

[PaulaB]

I was very scathing of her years ago, but you grow up.  Diana was not the innocent she portrayed herself to be.  She also used the media she also was unfaithful.  it was a doomed marriage he because he had not got over Camilla, she because she wouldn't take advise and was just too young.  That horrible wedding dress was the sort of thing a child would chose not an adult.  Its past time that Camilla be known as what she is Princess of Wales, Diana wasn't the first nor will she be the last so stop acting as if it was only hers.
Double post auto-merged: September 24, 2014, 01:54:48 PM

The more I got to know about her, the more I saw her, and the closer I followed her activities. I slowly realised how truly wrong we all were, and how the Duchess was truly a victim of a very spiteful media.

The article posted at the start of this thread isn't a propaganda article at all, it is however an accurate description of how many people have been charmed by the Duchess. I relate very well to the words expressed in the article, as I am one of those people who have gone from disliking her, to actually enjoying her presence, and role within the Monarchy. I look forward to her one day being Crowned Queen alongside the Prince of Wales!

Same here and Diana trashing Charles in the interview that ended her marriage.

[sandy]

Diana was 19 when engaged  I don't think the dress was "horrible." Charles even said "you look wonderful" when she walked to his side after her procession down the aisle.

Charles' trashing Diana via Dimbleby was also a factor. But of course that is ignored. He called her out literally as a broodmare that he was forced to marry.

I know people go on about the excuses made for Diana. I see a barrel full of excuses made for Charles.

[TLLK]

Both sides have made excuses for Diana, Camilla and Charles.

[sandy]

I do notice Dimbleby is sort of brushed aside by some as "nothing." And it had various serious ramifications including the divorce of the PBs

[amabel]

Both sides have made excuses for Diana, Camilla and Charles.

well surprise surprise they were all human. They had their faults and their good points.  They did stupid things and made mistakes.  Most people do, and make problems for themselves.  But it seems that every time Charles and Cam's names come up people have to recall their mistakes and follies, so while there are excuses for the things Diana did, that were wrong or foolish, IMO there are excuses for the things that C and Cam did.  they were all 3 in a difficult position, and they didn't' chose the best way out of it...

[Limabeany]

 Charles and Camilla put everyone in a difficult position the moment he asked her to give her opinion of Diana before he married her. Let's not spread the blame so equitably on everyone else.

[amabel]

Charles and Camilla put everyone in a difficult position the moment he asked her to give her opinion of Diana before he married her. Let's not spread the blame so equitably on everyone else.

How is his asking someone for advice in whether she thinks his new girlfriend is suitable "putting everyone in a difficult position?"  OK many men would not do such a thing.  Some men DO ask old girlfriends for romantic advice...
Do you really think that Charles could not make up his own mind about marrying Diana? According to some friends, they advised Against his marrying Di on the grounds that she was too young for him and not up ot the role of Princess or his wife but he clearly ignored them.  People do what they want to do  and rarely listen to advice except when it is what they want to do themselves.

[sandy]

But Camilla was not just an "old girlfriend." Charles began another affair with her ca. 1979. Very close to the time he courted Diana.

One friend Penny Romsey advised against it. According to various biographers his other friends were for it including Camilla who even played hostess as the "safe" married friend for Charles and Diana.

I do think overall Charles married Diana to get heirs. He thought she would be compliant about being "civilized" like APB was.

[FanDianaFancy]

I agree with  sandy, her last sentence there.
"I do think overall Charles married Diana to get heirs. He thought she would be compliant about being "civilized" like APB was"
LDFS  came from mthe nobility and knew the deal, but  really was  young, sheltered, in love, and caught between two worlds in opinion in the world of  her  rank in life and  the new   ways  of the  early  1980's. mShe thought and wanted love, a husband, a  home, a family...jsut them. No  others  in the marriage or on the side and no divorce.

amabel, I am not being critcal of you.
PC  was ready  for marriage when he  started really looking and chose LDFS . He chose her along with   advice from his  closest  advisors, etc. She  was vetted so to speak.  So it was said  CPB was part of that  adviosry group.

Our world and relatiy  is not  like these people.

PC  needed  heirs from his line. He was heir. It was simply time.

CPB was not simply an old  friend  and former girlfriend. She and PC  cont. their affair  on/off between her pregnancies. He  also   was dating starlets, suitable  titled girls of  his kingdom, and  other side dishes like Kanga.

Once gain LDFS being too young is  a nice hindsight thought.  Rumor has it  his friends thought she was too young...I wonder if that was true.  Of course it  is hindsight  now to say  what  would  have been if he had waited.  No one had a crystal ball to foretell the future   of what the 1980's was going to be like and what the pool of  girls  who went through the 1980s  as teens would  have been like.  Now, we  can, oh  my. PC  really  would  have faced very slim  pickings had he waited  to go through the 1980's  or even up to 1985  for  the princess.

He  HAD to find a suitable wife  material.  PAndrew was coming up the rear sooner or later  as he  was  old enough. Even PEd  coming up on 21  soon could have, was old enough almost  to   marry and start a family post 1983.
The girls, I mean WOMEN, were not going to get  older and be  without a  scandalous past  .
They were all younger than he was. The girls were really  only going to get younger.  LDS went through the 1970's as a  teenager. The next pool of titled girls would have gone through the their teen years in the 1980s' , LOL!!!!! Good luck  it would have been finding even a girl  from the aristos/nobility  wihtout a  past  to come present from that pool.  It would have good luck finding a girl  from that aged pool who would have  wanted to be saddled with an old man, PC. Ewwwwww.   1980's  getting married at 20 and start having babies  12 mnths after? A 1980's girl? Nah!!!!!!  What about  college? Career? I mean aristo girls too. They too went throught eh greedy  Everything Goes  1980. 1980's  was really a different  world.  She  would have much  younger too., About   her 20 to his 36 to her 20.
YES, PC  had  choice but also   he  his life was kind of  set in the choices.

[amabel]

I was very scathing of her years ago, but you grow up.  Diana was not the innocent she portrayed herself to be.  She also used the media she also was unfaithful.  it was a doomed marriage he because he had not got over Camilla, she because she wouldn't take advise and was just too young.  That horrible wedding dress was the sort of thing a child would chose not an adult

No she wasn't an innocent, and she did use the media, However, Charles's side also uesed the media against her... They were both unfaithful,  they were both at fault in the sniping and arguing that went on at the last years of their marriage.  As for her dress, I think that while now at a distance it may seem OTT, it was a beautiful "fairy tale princess" dress which fitted her image and which suited the very large cathedral she was married in. And she was very young when she married C, why hold her wedding dress taste at 19 against her?


[mod] Quote fixed :flower:[/mod]

[Limabeany]

Charles and Camilla put everyone in a difficult position the moment he asked her to give her opinion of Diana before he married her. Let's not spread the blame so equitably on everyone else.

How is his asking someone for advice in whether she thinks his new girlfriend is suitable "putting everyone in a difficult position?"  OK many men would not do such a thing.  Some men DO ask old girlfriends for romantic advice...
Do you really think that Charles could not make up his own mind about marrying Diana? According to some friends, they advised Against his marrying Di on the grounds that she was too young for him and not up ot the role of Princess or his wife but he clearly ignored them.  People do what they want to do  and rarely listen to advice except when it is what they want to do themselves.

Sometimes I read about Charles, Camilla and Diana here and I wonder if the posters are married, and if they really would not mind all the things they think Diana shouldn't have minded especially as a woman who married as a very young 19 year old.

[SophieChloe]

Totally agree, Lima! 

[amabel]

Yes I'm married.  And I would say that marriage is very very difficult.  Anyone who expects it to be all hearts and Flowers as Diana did, is in for dsisappointmtn.  I don't blame her.. but she was very Young ad immature when she married.  Don't know what you mean exactly .... Di's problems were that she was too young to cope with marriage, to anyone much less a marriage where there was always  going to be a huge amount of public attention and people watching her.. She was ill prepared for being a Royal wife, not realising how much "dull duty" there is and how little glamour... or how much the RF loves Balmoral and its rural routines...
She knew - must have known that Charles had been involved wit Camilla and that she and he would be living quite close to Cam in Gloucestershire,... so if she was jealous of their relationship, if she felt that she didn't want to be with a man who was still good Friends with an old girlfriend, why did she marry him? Even she did not say that Charles was still physically involved with Cam in the early years of the marriage, so she was clearly at best only a friend whom he saw occasionally, and Di clearly didn't like even that.  but given that he and Cam were ex lovers and old Friends, and that it was well known that Cam was someone who advised him on things, WHY did Diana accept a man who was so close to his old girlfriend?

[cinrit]

I'm not sure that anyone has said that Diana should not have minded what she had to contend with, but it has been said that perhaps she could have handled it in a better way.  That said, I'm also on record as saying that at her very young age, I probably would have done a lot (or all) of the same things.

Cindy

[amabel]

I agree the problem was that she was just too young to cope.  had she been older or at least wiser, she would have realised that marrying into the RF isn't all that glamorous and that it usually involves a lot of regimentation, a lot of well I wont say hard work but rigid "doing duties". even their fun times are pretty regimented and that there was the constant deferring to the Queen and QM back then.
But I think she was Young and immature and she DID see it as all "roses round the door" with a constantly attentive husband who would be there all the time for her.. and not realising that Charles is a  loner, who also had his own duties that he spent a fair bit of time doing and his own amusements which he didn't always share.  .and which she didn't really enjoy...
I think that she ignored the fact that he had old girlfriends particularly Camilla, at first whom he was still friends with, then became jealous of them when I think she began to understand that she and he weren't hitting it off that well either in the bedroom or outside it. I think she began to find the highgrove crowd dull, old and too "suck up" to Charles and she just could not handle their being around.. either.. or the RFs' killing sprees in Blamoral.  Yes, his friendship with Cam was a big problem, but she had lots of other ones.

[sandy]

Camilla as a "friend" was Charles problem. He knew he could never be just friends with her but he wanted to have his cake and eat it too. He had no problem seeing off Lady Tryon, he could have ousted Camilla.

I don't think a woman believing her husband honorable is hearts and flowers. Charles problem was not that he was a loner but self entitled and spoiled. Charles wanted her as a broodmare and that was why he chose someone so much younger. He wanted the heirs, the wife, and the mistress.

Diana was not prepared to be a Royal but she was a natural, and just went on with it and did the tours and appearances and the public took to her. Charles other problem was that he was jealous of his own wife. Diana did her royal duties and did not find them "dull." Her work turned out to be something she took to.

Yes I'm married.  And I would say that marriage is very very difficult.  Anyone who expects it to be all hearts and Flowers as Diana did, is in for dsisappointmtn.  I don't blame her.. but she was very Young ad immature when she married.  Don't know what you mean exactly .... Di's problems were that she was too young to cope with marriage, to anyone much less a marriage where there was always  going to be a huge amount of public attention and people watching her.. She was ill prepared for being a Royal wife, not realising how much "dull duty" there is and how little glamour... or how much the RF loves Balmoral and its rural routines...
She knew - must have known that Charles had been involved wit Camilla and that she and he would be living quite close to Cam in Gloucestershire,... so if she was jealous of their relationship, if she felt that she didn't want to be with a man who was still good Friends with an old girlfriend, why did she marry him? Even she did not say that Charles was still physically involved with Cam in the early years of the marriage, so she was clearly at best only a friend whom he saw occasionally, and Di clearly didn't like even that.  but given that he and Cam were ex lovers and old Friends, and that it was well known that Cam was someone who advised him on things, WHY did Diana accept a man who was so close to his old girlfriend?

The thing is Charles was passing off Camilla as a "friend" and even had Diana spend time with her. Why did Diana accept Charles? Well she believed in HIM and at the time thought he would behave honorably and say goodbye to Camilla. She did not count on Camilla not wanting to give Charles up and Charles not being willing to keep Camilla totally out of his life. It was not as if she "asked for it" or was a masochist of some sort. At the time she thought Charles loved her and only her.

Plus Camilla was a rather plain woman with a husband and two young children. 

Diana had a splendid work ethic I don't get the put downs of that.

[amabel]

I'm not sure that anyone has said that Diana should not have minded what she had to contend with, but it has been said that perhaps she could have handled it in a better way.  That said, I'm also on record as saying that at her very young age, I probably would have done a lot (or all) of the same things.

Cindy

Cindy, I don't mean this as a personal question but honestly, if you were not into huntin' and shooting etc. would you marry one of the senior royals?? I do question Why Diana did that.  OK she was brought up to the upper class country background of "killing things" and tolerated it, but surely she must have realised on some level that she didn't really like it much and found it boring.. yet she MUST Have known that Charles loves it. That they would spend as much time up at Balmoral or some country place watching animals being hunted as they would going to the opera..

[cinrit]

^^ That's a hard question to answer, amabel.  I'm deeply into animal welfare and against hunting, so my answer would be no...I wouldn't marry anyone who was into hunting and shooting be they royal or not, even at 19 or 20 years of age.  I'm not sure Diana was thinking that way, though.  She may have found it boring, but I'm not sure that she found it offensive, at least not at that stage of her life.  I think later, she was totally against it....

Cindy

[Curryong]

I'm not sure that anyone has said that Diana should not have minded what she had to contend with, but it has been said that perhaps she could have handled it in a better way.  That said, I'm also on record as saying that at her very young age, I probably would have done a lot (or all) of the same things.

Cindy

Cindy, I don't mean this as a personal question but honestly, if you were not into huntin' and shooting etc. would you marry one of the senior royals?? I do question Why Diana did that.  OK she was brought up to the upper class country background of "killing things" and tolerated it, but surely she must have realised on some level that she didn't really like it much and found it boring.. yet she MUST Have known that Charles loves it. That they would spend as much time up at Balmoral or some country place watching animals being hunted as they would going to the opera..

Which is why I think Diana (who had had no serious boyfriends) fell in love with a fantasy figure from a Cartland or Mills and Boon novel, who would sweep her away to his palace where they would live happily ever after. I do not think that she thought of royal routine or hunting, shooting and fishing and polo. Just that she would be safe forever.

[sandy]

Charles wanted a mother for his heirs and she was much younger. So the girl was naive about life and fell for him . She though he loved her too. And the man did propose to her.

Charles knew darn well Diana fell off a horse and did not hunt (as did the populace of the world before Diana got married).  When he and Diana went to Balmoral she went on walks with him and watched him fish (which was where she was first seen with him).  And once again, she had bad morning sickness the first time after the marriage she went to Balmoral. Nobody should blame her for not going out watching animals get shot--when she felt like throwing up. Kate gets passes for this now.
Double post auto-merged: October 04, 2014, 03:25:05 PM

^^ That's a hard question to answer, amabel.  I'm deeply into animal welfare and against hunting, so my answer would be no...I wouldn't marry anyone who was into hunting and shooting be they royal or not, even at 19 or 20 years of age.  I'm not sure Diana was thinking that way, though.  She may have found it boring, but I'm not sure that she found it offensive, at least not at that stage of her life.  I think later, she was totally against it....

Cindy

To be fair Charles gave up hunting during the time one of his lady friends urged him to go vegetarian.

[amabel]

^^ That's a hard question to answer, amabel.  I'm deeply into animal welfare and against hunting, so my answer would be no...I wouldn't marry anyone who was into hunting and shooting be they royal or not, even at 19 or 20 years of age.  I'm not sure Diana was thinking that way, though.  She may have found it boring, but I'm not sure that she found it offensive, at least not at that stage of her life.  I think later, she was totally against it....

Cindy

thanks Cindy It does baffle me a bit, sicne I am sure on some level she knew that she found country life and picking up birds and tramping on muddy walks and watching men shoot boring...why did she do it?  I suppose it is like marrying a man who likes football and going to the games for a while, but then giving up.  But the RF take their hobbies like shooting very seriously, and I think that Charles had been doing the fishing and shooting etc for so long he wasn't likely to give them up.. I don't think he minded if Di didn't come along but she didn't want to go BUT was bored and unhappy when left to her own devices. And I think that she gave up the "Liking to watch him shoot" etc rather abruptly and very early in their marriage.
I don't know if she was ever against it from a principled POV even later in life.   I think she was Ok with it and with the boys doing it, but had no interest herself and found it boring.. Rosa Monckton said that she sadi at one stage that they boys were "Out killing things", when at Balmoral, and that she had had been brought up to that sort of blood sport life, and had no real problem with it except that she had no interest in it either.  but problaby the "being in love" with Charles was at first enough to blind her...
Double post auto-merged: October 04, 2014, 04:55:30 PM

Cindy

Which is why I think Diana (who had had no serious boyfriends) fell in love with a fantasy figure from a Cartland or Mills and Boon novel, who would sweep her away to his palace where they would live happily ever after. I do not think that she thought of royal routine or hunting, shooting and fishing and polo. Just that she would be safe forever.

I agree. I think that she saw marriage to him as a haven, and didn't think about the duties or the Balmoral routine. But she was much the same at 30plus when she fell in love with Hasnat Khan, hoping and expecting that he would be there as teh perfect husband and be there all the time for her..

[sandy]

Diana went to watch polo games, they took annual ski trips, and liked swimming. Yes, they did have things in common. Diana did not ride and Charles would have known that (since every body else did). Diana had morning sickness at Balmoral 1981 which did not make it a joyful experience to go out trekking when she felt sick. Diana was not a huntress and their dates did not consist of Diana shooting things--she would walk with Charles in Balmoral, watch him fish and hunt. The man knew she was not big on hunting. Some fairness please.

Hasnet and Diana were together and it was not necessarily Diana's fault that it did not work out. He did not want to be seen with her in public. She grew tired of it. Couples do break up.



Diana did not want her husband to have Camilla on the side as a friend (with benefits).

[TLLK]

^^ That's a hard question to answer, amabel.  I'm deeply into animal welfare and against hunting, so my answer would be no...I wouldn't marry anyone who was into hunting and shooting be they royal or not, even at 19 or 20 years of age.  I'm not sure Diana was thinking that way, though.  She may have found it boring, but I'm not sure that she found it offensive, at least not at that stage of her life.  I think later, she was totally against it....

Cindy

I agree that initially she wasn't against it but just not enthusiastic about it personally. Diana grew up in that country sport environment and the food she ate at Althorp was apparently all estate generated (produce, meat, game.)