How did Diana do in school?

[sandy]

Back then it was less common for aristo women to attend university. They were expected to marry well. I think Charles and Diana were on the same page clearly with the school selection.

[TLLK]

what was communicated to Diana?

Her siblings called her "Brian" which I understand was the name of a slow snail in a children's show that was popular during her childhood. I don't get the feeling that her parents really wanted to discover why their youngest daughter was struggling at school.

[sandy]

She probably had a learning disorder which could have been rectified. But back then aristo women  were supposed to marry well. Sarah wanted to marry the very wealthy Duke of Westminster who broke up with her.

[amabel]

what was communicated to Diana?

Her siblings called her "Brian" which I understand was the name of a slow snail in a children's show that was popular during her childhood. I don't get the feeling that her parents really wanted to discover why their youngest daughter was struggling at school.

yes they teased her because she was seen as stupid. but while I don't think she was STUPID, there was IMO no chance that she would ever bei going to Uni and she would not have wanted it. 
I think her parents didn't care if she wasn't doing well at school, that's true.  Partly because she didn't need qualfiications to do a little job and marry well.. but partly because IMO the pair of them Jonny and Frances were a selfish pair, wrapped up in their own lives, and they didn't care as long as she was quiet and not in trouble. I
think if they thought about it at all, they jus thought, "oh she failed exams because she's not very smart, or didn't study much but ti doesn't matter, we'll get her into a finishing school where she can learn French and cookery.. "
However when Diana didn't want to stay at the Finishing school they let her come home too easily IMO.. they could have pushed her a bit to get some kind of training, even if ti was for cookery or whatever, which might have given her a sense of achievement..
but it is not the fault of her parents that she didn't get further education. She didn't have the qualifications to get in.. and would not have been interested in it anyway.
Some upper class girls did go to college, if they were very bright and interested, I dont think that upper crust parents would usually say "No" even at that time, if a girl wanted to study further.  Just that they didn't exactly push their daughters to study further because it wasn't considered necessary for them to have a uni education.
Lady Jane Wellesley had a degree and became a producer or journalist with the BBC, she was a career girl and she was a little older than Diana.. so it wasn't impossible for a girl of the upper class to get a third level education and pursue a career.  I saw that Amanda Knatchbull became a social worker so I THINK she had a degree...
Di's sisters both got decent O levels and went into office jobs when they left school..

[sandy]

Jane Wellesley though stayed single. She did not aim for the great match, she enjoyed her career.

[amabel]

She seems to have had several romances and is now a writer.

[Curryong]

I do think that one of Diana's main failings, or maybe a failing of her upbringing, was that she was never encouraged or persuaded or forced to stick at anything.

I do think that she had great emotional intelligence and was not unintelligent,  but the constantly failing at exams at school for instance would send red lights flashing for most parents nowadays. They would get some tests done, (slight learning difficulties perhaps) or get special tuition on weaker subjects. I do wonder whether there was a very slight form of dislexia lingering there, only because of Harry's experiences with exams and some forms of reading difficulties being hereditary. The headmistress of her school seemed just flummoxed as to what the problem was.

It was not just that, though. She couldn't bear to stay at finishing school at sixteen because she felt uncomfortable there. She was allowed to return home within three months. She didn't want to return to the school where she taught little once dance because she felt pressured by the parents. So she just left, without any explanation really. Later, she didn't want to read about former Princesses of Wales, feeling that they were dull and boring, so she didn't.

Just lots of examples over the early years of not saying to herself 'Well I have to succeed at this so it will be better for me to stick at it until I've learned it. With Charles it was just as intense in the other direction, ie being made to stay for years at a school he loathed and detested because he had to 'man up'. I don't know which is worse!

[amabel]

Well i'd question the great emtoinal intelligence... It seems to me that someone of great emotional intelligence would not screw up so often with her romantic relationships. Anyway that's not really the issue.
But I don't know fi her school were really that bothered about her failing exams, were they?
I think that they just thoguth she wasn't that clever, or that she was a bit bothered by her family dramas and problems and that it didn't realy matter because she was well off and didn't have to have a career or work for a living.
and I think her family ie parents didn't give a hoot because they were too selfish to bother.
But I do agree tat the reluctance to stick at things was a problem of hers, almost to the point of a character failing.  She didn't stick at school, she could have surely stayed another year, worked harder and tried to get an O level or 2, if she'd really wanted to.  And she was the same about the Finishing school - left after a few weeks and she dropped the dancing teaching after a few weeks, sayng she'd hurt her foot.
and in later life, Pat Jephson said that he had various projects that he thoght she would enjoy when she was separated form Charles, and they would keep her "noticed" by the press and public and keep her being seen as a working Royal but with more choice of what she wanted to do.  but that when Diana found that these were projects she would have to "see to the end", she didn't want to do them and he found it harder to find interesting work for her to do.

[royalanthropologist]

It makes it all the more extraordinary that the queen/QM imagined that this very poorly educated and demonstrably immature girl was going to be a great life long companion to her son and would one day be the matriarch of the family. I would hope that nobody in Diana's situation will ever be encouraged to marry a prince of wales. One wonders whether they have really learnt their lessons.

I cannot imagine that Diana could have coped with something as serious as the abdication crisis. Whether she could have been able to act as a support to a husband who was a reluctant or diffident king.  Someone like the QM may not have had O levels but she certainly understood what needed to be done and how it ought to be done in such situations. Even the queen was given important constitutional and personal lessons that have preserved her throne in times of crisis. Diana was way too impulsive and emotional for the situation in which she was placed.

I wish the upper classes realized that no matter how rich or powerful you are, education does help. Elizabeth I was incredibly well-educated and it all paid off in her reign. Now we have a situation where aristocratic women are implicitly encouraged to be lazy, under educated and dependent.

[amabel]

I really don't know what you meaen. SOME aristocratic women don't go in for education, others do.  As they are usually rich enough to not have to work, I don't see how ti mkes tehm "lazy" or "dependent."
And I'm sure that the RF didn't think that a few O levels meant anything very much.  what counted was character and Diana was very young, I think they felt that her character was not developed, as yet and that she was "Mouldeable".  I'm sure the Queen and her mother (Insofar as they thought of it at all) thought that if Charles was borthered by her not being very well educated that was HIS affair (neither of them were "educated" in terms of schoolwork anyway).
Camilla has only a moderate education and is not an intellectual, but she is discreet, loyal and sensible.

[Curryong]

I was musing not so much on Diana's level of education so much, (or lack of it) as why she was never pushed into completing anything early in her childhood. As far as Diana's education was concerned, as has been said there might have been a mild learning disability there that wasn't picked up at her first school and so was just left.

I do wonder if her siblings' teasing made things worse and the lack of self confidence because she didn't seem to be a great student was exacerbated. Therefore she stopped trying quite early on. We've all seen children who wail 'I can't do this, don't want to' when faced with various tasks they feel are beyond them. However, with careful coaching from parents, teachers, mentors they usually can do it, and therefore feel a sense of accomplishment. I do wonder if, back when Diana was still very young no parent or teacher provided back-up, she did fail, and was never encouraged to try again.

It just seems to me that after Diana's mother left the children were left to their own devices a good deal. Johnny encouraged good manners, the writing of ThankYou notes and a spirit of egalitarianism in his children. However I just don't know whether, (as he appears to have been a fairly good natured sort of man) he ever pushed them to develop self-discipline, which is really an essential part of character-building. (Self-discipline is a big part of the Queen's character for example in spite of an abysmal education.) A lack of that plus not feeling good about school may have programmed the older Diana to feel that if she didn't try then she didn't really fail.
Just musing on these things!

[amabel]

well yes, I think that the Spencer parents both left Diana to cope alone a lot.  she didn't want to try things she wasn't good at or things she found difficult and they didn't push her at all or insist that she had to try. They coud have insisted on her staying at least 6 months at finishing school.. or that she had to go back to school and try and get ONE o level.
But the lack of "trying" was a life long problem with her I think.  She did some things, that she had been trained in from childhood like the thank you notes, and she did her paperwork quickly, but in her "post Charles" days she was not that active In her charity work, she wasn't willing to undertake projects that Jephson found for her... because she knew I think that she would not stick them to the end...

[sandy]

I think she had some learning disability issues and good parents would have seen to it that she got it treated. Today there are so many clinics and intervention to help students over learning disabilities. Diana said she "froze up" when she was test taking. It sounds like the parents should have done some intervention. This was something that could have been corrected. It was not that she was lazy or not trying.  Too bad they did not care enough to see what was going on.
Double post auto-merged: July 06, 2017, 11:10:00 AM

It makes it all the more extraordinary that the queen/QM imagined that this very poorly educated and demonstrably immature girl was going to be a great life long companion to her son and would one day be the matriarch of the family. I would hope that nobody in Diana's situation will ever be encouraged to marry a prince of wales. One wonders whether they have really learnt their lessons.

I cannot imagine that Diana could have coped with something as serious as the abdication crisis. Whether she could have been able to act as a support to a husband who was a reluctant or diffident king.  Someone like the QM may not have had O levels but she certainly understood what needed to be done and how it ought to be done in such situations. Even the queen was given important constitutional and personal lessons that have preserved her throne in times of crisis. Diana was way too impulsive and emotional for the situation in which she was placed.

I wish the upper classes realized that no matter how rich or powerful you are, education does help. Elizabeth I was incredibly well-educated and it all paid off in her reign. Now we have a situation where aristocratic women are implicitly encouraged to be lazy, under educated and dependent.

The Queen and Princess Margaret did not get really great educations. Margaret especially (she complained later that her education was neglected).

The Queen Mother was known to take to her bed when there was a crisis. This was documented in various books. She did cope but her first reaction was to take to her bed. The QUeen herself has been known to ostrich about problems in the family and go into avoidance mode.

Charles needed a bride who would agree to ALL his ideas about marriage (including her being civilized about Camilla). Charles should have spelled out all the conditions and I mean all, and the bride to be could agree or not agree to the terms and be free to walk before any proposal could take place. Maybe someone would have agreed to his terms.

Diana was strong enough to face various problems. She handled the ski accident situation and more or less had to do some taking charge after Charles survived the avalanche and his friend was killed. And it took real strength to leave the Firm and regroup. She was not some weak little person.

[michelle0187]

In one documentaries, she was described as not really paying attention in her classes and her mind being elsewhere. I believe she felt pretty thick as a child while her younger brother did well. Fortunately she was given the opportunity to learn things that most who did very well in school, couldn't.

[TLLK]

In one documentaries, she was described as not really paying attention in her classes and her mind being elsewhere. I believe she felt pretty thick as a child while her younger brother did well. Fortunately she was given the opportunity to learn things that most who did very well in school, couldn't.

:goodpost: While I believe that Diana had a mild learning disability that affected her ability to learn, I agree that she was given a good opportunity to learn as much as she possibly could at school and afterwards during her tenure as Princess of Wales.

[sandy]

I think if Diana had a tutor or went to get treated for learning disability she could have passed those exams. She said in an interview she just froze up and forgot what she learned when a test was administered. I think her parents were remiss.

[TLLK]

@sandy-Yes if she'd had the support as a child/teen then I do believe that she would have been able to pass her O levels/GCSEs or even a few A levels like Harry and Beatrice.

The family qualifications - Telegraph

[amabel]

In one documentaries, she was described as not really paying attention in her classes and her mind being elsewhere. I believe she felt pretty thick as a child while her younger brother did well. Fortunately she was given the opportunity to learn things that most who did very well in school, couldn't.

what thngs???OK she joined the RF, but i'd say that most girls of her class could have adjusted to Royal life as well and better than she did.
Double post auto-merged: July 08, 2017, 04:44:58 AM

@sandy-Yes if she'd had the support as a child/teen then I do believe that she would have been able to pass her O levels/GCSEs or even a few A levels like Harry and Beatrice.

The family qualifications - Telegraph

Did Harry get A levels?  I don't believe Diana was interested in learning at least not as a young girl and problaby what stopped her passing exams was a simple lakc of knowledge, she hadn't been paying attention in class and was not abel to do well at the exams. I doubt if a tutor would have made any diference. She was not wiling to learn when she joined the RF, saying that she had "left school"...

[Curryong]

Apparently Harry has very bad dyslexia. I remember when he was with Chelsy and hiding from the photographers a reporter who was with them remarked that it stopped him from playing some word based board games to pass the time. It's extraordinary that that wasn't picked up at Ludgrove or Eton, and that he still managed to qualify as an Apache helicopter pilot.

King Carl Gustav of Sweden  has dyslexia and has signed his name wrongly on documents several times. While we don't know whether Diana had learning difficulties she could well have, and it just wasn't picked up. Susannah York the English actress, said her dyslexia had prevented her from reading scripts and she had to have them on tape and learn it by rote. Learning difficulties aren't just something you can ignore and people were and are classed as 'dumb' and 'thick' because of them.

[amabel]

I have not seen any signs that Diana had dyslexia, she wrote a lot of letters and I don't believe anyone's ever said "there were a lot of words spelled wrong". And I think that there is no definite evidence that she had any learning disabilities, I don't think "but she could have"..is any indication.  I think it is more likely she wasn't interested In school work and as you've said, "didn't try" at more than one thing because she found it difficult.  She didn't want to stay in the finishing school and her parents let her come home. She ddn't want to learn about previous Princesses, so she refused to read books on them.
I've heard someone saying that they only wrote very brief "briefing notes" because she wouldn't read a long one...

[Curryong]

So stupid, ey? But connected with people beautifully and her charisma brought out the crowds...

[amabel]

what has htat got to  do with anyitng?  I didn't say she was stupid, actually, I said that she was unwilling to learn which may co exist with stupidity, but does not necessarily do so.
But she could be extremely stupid and yet be very popular...

[royalanthropologist]

What I understand is that Diana completely refused to be guided by people that had been in this business for years. A long-standing experience lady in waiting was assigned and she blanked her out, typical of someone whose maturity is not quite there.  She imagined that because she was popular and pulled in the crowds, that was enough to sustain her as Princess of Wales. History has taught us that that was a very bad misjudgment on her part.

When Diana started making mistakes (partly because of her impulsiveness, emotionalism and inability to use the resources available to her): she went back to default mode saying that nobody supported her. The men in grey suits have kept that institution going for decades with their dour routines. Diana wanted to bring glamour and drama. It all became one big publicity stunt with exaggerated emotions and responses but then it all came crushing down later on. She might have been better served reading a lot about previous princesses of wales and their approach to the role.

[sandy]

Diana did have a compatible Lady in Waiting Anne Beckwith Smith. She did not blank Anne out. That is a matter of record.

DIana did not "imagine" she was popular. She was popular. One can't "imagine" popularity. No it was not a big publicity stunt.
Double post auto-merged: July 08, 2017, 10:41:19 AM

what has htat got to  do with anyitng?  I didn't say she was stupid, actually, I said that she was unwilling to learn which may co exist with stupidity, but does not necessarily do so.
But she could be extremely stupid and yet be very popular...

Diana was not stupid. Decidedly not.
Double post auto-merged: July 08, 2017, 10:42:56 AM

I have not seen any signs that Diana had dyslexia, she wrote a lot of letters and I don't believe anyone's ever said "there were a lot of words spelled wrong". And I think that there is no definite evidence that she had any learning disabilities, I don't think "but she could have"..is any indication.  I think it is more likely she wasn't interested In school work and as you've said, "didn't try" at more than one thing because she found it difficult.  She didn't want to stay in the finishing school and her parents let her come home. She ddn't want to learn about previous Princesses, so she refused to read books on them.
I've heard someone saying that they only wrote very brief "briefing notes" because she wouldn't read a long one...

There are other types of learning disabilities. The parents did not bother to check.  It is amazing how this woman you put down was admired by Mandela, MOther Teresa and others. Nothing to sneeze at.

[royalanthropologist]

Diana imagined that the role of the princess of wales was all about courting and sustaining popularity and publicity. As her fate in that role shown, there was a lot more to it. Diana was offered one of the queen's long term ladies in waiting to help her settle into what is a complex role for a 19 year old. She wanted none of it, considering the training boring.  Look how it all turned out in the end when Diana decided to do it her own way. Perhaps she might have had a better result if she listened to the old and trusted courtiers that tried to help her instead of labeling them "the enemy". Just a thought